I need help guys and gals. Ive been doing research on soil making for so long now. The more research i do, the more questions I cant find answers to online. Before I ask, know that I am not asking if this soil will "work". I understand soil making isnt set in stone. What Im asking is if my recipe looks sound. Is there too much/not enough of anything? Any ratios risky or wacky in any way? Im making 11cu ft. of base for four 20gal fabric pots. 2/3 of that base will be the top 2/3 of the pots. 1/3 of that base will be used for the hot soil in the bottom 1/3 of the pots. Heres my base: 50% peat 30% lava rock/pumice 20% compost/ewc Do you have any opinion/experience towards my ratios? Most ratios i see are equal parts. Regarding amendments, is anything added to base soil considered an amendment? I know Crab Meal is an amendment but is Glacial Rock Dust considered an amendment as well? My amendments are going to be measured by making a mix of all of them, then adding 3cups of that mix per cu. ft. of base soil to the base soil. My amendment mix is for 4.3 cu ft. of base soil. So following what I said earlier, im going to be adding 12.8 cups of this amendment mix to my 4.3cu ft. of base soil. Amendment mix: 1cup neem seed meal 1cup alfalfa meal 1cup chicken manure 2cups kelp meal 1cup crab meal 1cup fish meal 1cup malted barley flour 4cups glacial rock dust+oyster shell flour 6cups charged biochar 1cup yucca meal 1cup gypsum I know it could work. What I don't know is if I'm correct in mixing each of these ingredients the way I'm mixing them and applying them in the ratios I am. For example, should i apply my glacial rock dust by itself depending on cu ft. of the base? Too much or too little of my lime agent oyster shell flour? Is a liming agent necessary? I've seen some not use or talk about any lime agents. Too much calcium sources? Do you need to lime the top 2/3rds of base soil? I understand the whole keep it simple idea, but I believe a soil should have a wetting agent(yucca) and some extra sulphur(gypsum). Some crab meal for chitin and titin. Alfalfa and neem so I dont have to make teas, to instill pest protection inside the soil, and to add extra organic matter and proteins. Malted barley for the plethora of enzymes. Multiple amendments are to as well aid in the calcium percentage of my soil and how its involved in the CEC of a soil. Charged biochar for the carbon and bacterial homes. Why not just try it instead of pestering us? I dont think anyone enjoys failing 5 grows until they succeed when advice couldve guided the grower to a successful grow. Not to mention how much money/time is wasted failing. Then why dont you just keep it simple? I believe in a quality and whole soil as soon as it could be possibly made to ensure all has been done to achieve it. Thus creating a great product without creating a less than great product until the 5th harvest. Basically, for efficiency. Why make an inferior product when you can make a better one sooner. Youre overthinking this. If trying to gain knowledge/advice/opinions from more experienced growers than myself is overthinking, then yes I am. As always, sorry for the wall of text and thank you for even taking the time to read it or help me at all. Sent from my SM-G986U1 using Grasscity Forum mobile app
I started using scooby doo's,and coots mix and its working great! Check out scoobys notes,there well written and easy to understand.
I would do 40% peat 40% aeration 20% compost Yes anything added is an amendment (including rock dust) which is why I think its simpler to not mix and try to figure out how many cups of your mix you should add. Just follow the basic 1cup per amendment per CF (gypsum is 1/2c). So in your case 4 cups per amendment (2 gypsum). it's a lot simpler that way IMHO. You need to lime all the soil (it counters the acidity of peat)
Total amendments used should not exceed 4 cups per cubic foot of base correct? Or is this old? I'm planning 1/3 cup per cuft Neem, kelp, crab, fishbone 1/2 gypsum 1 cup mbp 1 cup lime 5 cups basalt Puts me at 3.8 total cups of all amendments used per CUft. To me when I hear "follow the basic 1 cup per amendment per cuft of base" I think of adding 12 cups of amendments per cuft of base if you are planning on using 12 different amendments. Which to me sounds overkill
I never heard the 4 cup rule. As for 12 cups, yeah you normally wouldn't be adding that many amendments, there really is no reason for it. If you want my recommendation I would remove the manure, fish and alfalfa, it might be too much at any rate and would also require you to let the soil stand for a few weeks because it will get hot. You can always top-dress with them if you want. I would also reduce the rock dust to 2 cups, 1 cup lime (oyster shell) and 1/2 cup gypsum. I would also double check the recommended dose for yucca.
I have a snapshot of an old post from gimick. I thought it was one of your posts on the updated recipe page sorry! Also no manures here. Just kelp, neem/karanja, MPB, gypsum, lime, basalt. I'll topdress fishbone meal for flowering since this revised no till recipe is pretty balanced or maybe even slightly low on P and K for a bed that's going to be 24/7 flower. Here's my recipe so far.
FWIW... I’ve been using a recipe almost exactly like that post from gimik. Works well, I slurry tested the pH after it aged for a few months and it came out 6.8. I’ve never bumped up to the 1 cup version, but I can see it giving the mix extra juice. I did add some ( 1/3 cup /cf) greensand to my last batch of soil for some long term K and micros
im assuming you’re talking about raw or uncharged bio char. The point of making bio char is to fill all that empty pore space with a plethora or nutrients and microbes/fungi. this can be achieved by adding rich compost/castings, nutrient dense amendments, and/or innoculants and allowing them to soak in and age. I dont see how adding nutrients and microbes to any soil wont be of some benefit. Now adding raw carbon to a soil thats already lacking nutrients thats another story. Sent from my iPhone using Grasscity Forum
you can definitely mix all your amendments together to make the mixing process easier but you should really make sure you calculate proper ratios because once its mixed together theres no going back. based on your recipe id say your a little on the hot side. if it were me based on your 4.3 cu/ft id add these amendments in a bucket when your ready to mix your soil. 2 c. crab 2 c. neem 4 c. kelp 1.5 c. Alfalfa 2 c. MBP 4 c. oystershell 4c. gypsum 8c. Basalt RD id leave out the chicken and fish as theyre high N. crab, alfalfa and neem should have you covered for N. if you’re looking to add little P to avoid potential deficiencies in flower you can add 1/4 cup of Fish BONE meal which in your mix would equate to 1 Cup. I also do not think its necessary to layer your pots. in my experience plants in health soil will shoot roots straight to the bottom of the pot anyway so i never really bought in to the whole super soil layering thing. i think your better off with a well mixed homogeneous media. Goodluck! Edit: these recommendations are based on my experience mixing soil with high quality homeade castings made from aged cold compost. results may vary as the compost portion of your base is probably the most important aspect of these soils. Sent from my iPhone using Grasscity Forum
Think long term after 567 cycles an even mildly active bio char will soon be chock-full of the bio life you created over time. Always a good thing and the base for future larger containers perhaps in the future.
Thanks for the advice Many others said much of the same and I followed all yall advice. Might just be a killer soil! Sent from my SM-G986U1 using Grasscity Forum mobile app
Many years of good advice has lead to the soil mix you see in the "no till revisited" thread. It works. You say that you're interested in quality, efficiency and success yet you're trying to modify a recipe based on no real experience or knowledge. Want a better product sooner? Keep it simple and follow the recipe. This soil will run for years and you can play with adding stuff in later as you learn more. And a few more specific bits of advice... --Big pots!!! You're trying to create and sustain a mini ecosystem. I wouldn't use less than a 25g though a big bed is even better. Personally my plants get about 60-90g soil each. --Liming. It got cut out of the recipe but I'd still add dolomite lime or oyster shell. About .75-1 cup per cf. --Wetting agent. You'll be watering in plenty of aloe as you go. The time to use this in soilbuilding is when you're breaking up your peat moss. Peat can be very hydrophobic and it helps to premoisten it. Fill your pump sprayer with water and some aloe, soap etc. Then break/fluff up your peat onto a tarp or into tubs and moisten with your sprayer as you go. Close the lids or fold over the tarp to seal and allow the moisture to equalize inside. Remix in a day or two and repeat until lightly and evenly moistened.
Oh really? I remember someone, maybe you, kicking around this idea a couple years ago. Do you really notice a difference? Ive though of topdressing a bit to help my water get in a bit easier though I'm sure it would be much more effective mixed in.
Well I did notice it was easier getting the soil wet when I was mixing it, cant say much about how much of a difference its making in the bed because I'm watering with bluemats so I cant really tell, but I would assume it does help.
Knowledge is easily accessible if you got enough time, but yea I need that experience to do anything extremely different. I did end up going with the no-till recipe, with alfalfa split with neem and yucca for its surfactant properties. Changed up 3 part base to 40-40-20, mostly for convenience+cost with how many cu ft i was making. Studying liming for months really just makes liming a more webbed question/topic. In terms of knowledge. Experience might teach me differently about that. Waiting until i can do a soil test to see what its like without oyster. Planning to do 2x 20gallons in 4x4 tents, but i definitely was thinking of doing 1x 40 gallon per tent. Think thatll work, space wise? Definitely plan to do all ya said, thanks for the advice! Super tired from hand mixing 10cu ft solo for the first time Got anything against composting in a fabric pot?