Advanced Cloning Techniques - Hard to Root or Valuable Plants

Discussion in 'Advanced Growing Techniques' started by jcj77d, Jan 12, 2009.

  1. Im'a soil grower and have always rooted my clones and then put them in my soil mix. My situation now dictates a different approach and I need some serious advice from a rockwool or coco cube grower.

    I will be supplying healthy clones to patients and caregivers. None of these folks grow in soil :)confused:) and thus need their clones delivered to them in a cube. My questionz:

    Like nickster wants to know which medium is "best" for packaging up the clones - coco cubes or wool cubes.

    What "nutrient" solution do I use to keep the clones alive and flourishing in the coco/wool medium such that they will mature over time and be ready for delivery?

    And as always, as it seems, what is the ONLY way to prepare either a coco cube or wool cube prior to using it as a medium? i.e. what do I soak it in or wash it in?

    dudes, I'ma soil grower. IDK or have forgotten these coco/wool "tricks" many years ago. I simply don't know and am asking you guys, the experts in these matters. If you have organic soil medium/nutrient/management questions I'll be happy to return the favor.

    FTW people. :wave:
     
  2. Awesome great info thanks a bunch. Was always wondering how to do this
     
  3. #63 avocatdenfer, Dec 7, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 7, 2012
    I just soaked rockwool in strait water. how long do you hold the clone before it will be 'delivered' how long do they need to survive and flourish?
     
  4. I'm glad someone bumped this thread! Really good information and I wish I would have known about thia few weeks back.

    This post above though has some very good questions that I'm curious about! Especially since wouldn't the new plant be a hybrid since it shared genetics? Or must it be done of the same plant?


    I'm having issues with Maui as well but its human error i'm almost positive.
     
  5. Cheap rooting powder and stick it in the dirt has worked for me, even outdoors in the hot Florida sun. I often marvel at how good my results were back then when I did not care.
     
  6. I went through this exact same issue in 09. I was supplying dispensaries before the laws changed. I decided I like coco because everyone could use it but found rockwool growers did not want to go near it.

    I finally settled on rockwool. I was using Botanicare cal-mag PBP Veg and liquid karma at 500 ppm (approx 150+300+50) and it worked great.

    I have personally had issues with plants that did not want to transition from rockwool into soil without a long delay so I would keep a few aside with no nutrients on them for soil growers. I assume a starved plant will go hunt for nutrients faster.

    I currently use an aero cloner that has rapid rooters instead of neoprene collars. I love it because I get all the benefits of the mega oxygenated fresh water circulation but I dont have bare roots when its time to transplant. This might be an option because even rockwool growers can just insert the rooter into the rockwool.

    In fact its the easiest clone machine design I've seen.
    - A 5 gallon bucket and lid (use a 1 1/4 inch spade bit to drill up to 30 holes)
    - A small pump connected to 1/2" sprinkler pipe/tube that is crimped at the end. Put it in a pair of pantyhose to keep the rooter crumbs from cloging the spray bar
    - Use a pin to poke 100 holes in the tube...you dont get a spray like a regular clone machine but its plenty to keep the rooters wet and the water fresh.

    Ive got 2 of these and the one in the photo has spray jets but they are not needed I just had them so I used them. Tip...stick the tube through one of the whole in the lid so it can't tip over. You can also use it without rooter if you have something you can place over the holes and just expose a small slit (galvanized roofing disks).
     

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  7. I had an unknown haze that would not clone. I air layered it first try...so no I don't think so. I used soil and rockwool on 2 different branches and both took but the RW was harder to keep wet. I used KLN
     
  8. I love how different peoples opinions are. Years ago I read that PH did not effect cloning at all because PH only relates to nutrient availability and the plant is using stored nutrients to form the roots. Ever since I have never PH's my water again (maybe 1500 clones) and still get fine results.

    I have have tried all techniques and had results from back to back overnight death of 100+ clones to 100 % success.

    My advice
    1) Aero machine! Build a cheap one with a 5 gallon bucket and small pump for $20 (directions are in this thread)
    2) always sterilize everything. The pump, the bucket, the collars the razor...everything. I run my machine with bleach for 10 minutes, then run it to rinse for 10 and then fill it and run it for an hour to off gas
    3) USE AQUASHIELD. I used to be a PBP guy but now, this and cal mag are the only two botanicare products I can't live without.
    4) Make sure you are cutting in the right spot...not to young not to old. Nowadays most of my failure is due to bad parent stock...too woody, nutrient deficient moms etc.
    5) KLN... I have had many decent batches with just water (no hormones, nutrients, B1, ph...nothing) but with KLN roots explode
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. OK, I have been doing some reading and according to some folks experience, the clone can grow differently than the original plant from seed. For instance, I am growing Skunk #1, and have 3 potential phenotypes - A, B, C. Let us suppose plant A from seed looks to be the best plant at harvest. However, clones from A, B, & C are then grown and harvested - is it possible that plant B will in fact turn out to be the best yielding, etc? Now everyone agrees that once you clone, all of these plants should be identical if grown in the same environment, but some argue that you should not pick the phenotype based on the seed plant.
     
    Who has experimented with this? Who has gotten different results from the clone and the original plant?
     
  10. #70 pointswest, Jul 10, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 17, 2013

    When grafting techniques are used there is no transfer of DNA between the stock and scion. The grafted portion is a clone of the mother and the rootstock DOES NOT share any genetics with the graft.

    PW
     
  11.  
    I think I am somewhat confused by your question but if I understand it correctly my answer is this:
     
    All clones are not necessarily going to be indentical in a pure sense - if there are anomalies as the clones mature this could be due to a variety of influences as random as porosity of the soil in a particular container, nutrient leaching, and the list gets very long. However, genetically they will be pure copies of the mother and only the phenotype of each clone may vary slightly.
     
    Personally I am not familar with the reasons why one would not want to clone the seed plant. That doesn't make sense to me. And, FWIW, I know of productive mothers that are clones of clones perhaps five generations deep and the mothers still produce exceptionally healthy and powerfully potent mature plants. I think the average grower does not have the physical space and can safely produce a suffient number of plants to grow from seed for purposes of future propagation, take multiple clones, grow them to maturity, then decide which plant is most favorable, clone it, grow it healthy to mother plant status, and then start making clones of the plant for  future production (if I understand your original question correctly - perhaps not).
     
    I have read some articles that suggest that clones will morph over time and perhaps someone actually experienced that. If that morph does occur over four or five generations (or more) I imagine that it is very subtle. I have not read any published research substantiating that claim but that does not mean much. Perhaps it does occur.
     
  12. Hello blades i had a quick clonig qurstion to those using the soil cup/ humidity dome method.
    So first, how long do you usually keep your dome on? Mine have been in the dome for 6 days now and once a day foe the six days i would take the dome off for 10-20 mins. Hoe much longer will i need to keep it on? Out of the 14 clones only one looks as if it didnt make it. Hopw someone has the answer to my question.
    Thanks
    Diesel

    hola atcha gwala!

     
  13. Wow i thought this thrad seemed awesome from wut ive read. But it seems quite dead lol well thanks any ways
    Diesel

    hola atcha gwala!

     
  14. Once you see roots uniformly with the clones take the dome off. At this stage it is time to transplant.
     
    The next time you clone keep the dome on and remove it only to mist the inside of the dome. You can mist the clones but it is better to focus on keeping the medium moist and the dome moist. Try to control temperature and humidity using the vents and otherwise leave the dome on 24/7. No harm in taking it off periodically either but the main objective is to keep the environment warm, damp, and humid. In 7-10 days you should see roots.
     
    Just as a general statement for other readers, If it is taking longer than 10-12 days to root a clone one should double check the process they are using to take clones and ensure they are maximizing all they can to give the cutting a chance.
     
  15. Haha I use air layering religiously!! Absolutely swear by it, the harder to root plants are still hard to root, but the upside are still good. Doesn't matter to me If they take a month to root,the plant grows the whole time! Vegged this one for 2 weeks after I pulled her off, got near 2oz off

    Sent from my ADR6350 using Grasscity Forum mobile app

     

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  16. Important & helpful skill to have not just for marijuana. Cultivate everything!
     
  17. I will go over this 5 times before I take my next ones tomorrow morning... Need to get something happening!

    Sent from a large dark place on the internet...

     
  18. Great info here..... subbing in.
     
  19. I have been trying to clone under 400 watts with no luck. I am guessing that has been too much light. Is a 96 watt T5 HO too much for trying to clone?
     
  20. Hey guys. Tried some more... Got 4 of 5 healthy white widows and blue cheese's. Used clonex blue gel, razor to cut about 3 inch's of stem off with at least 5 little leaves each. Trimmed er back and took some outer layer off.

    They appear to have worked directly under a constant 15w cfl and a humidy dome style propagtor. No heating or anything just a mist 3 times a day.

    All my other attempts failed bar 1 with the cloning powder... As well as only a single leaf cuttings. So I have 5 clonesin a week and the mother plant bounced back and is ready for more already haha.

    Really wish I had come across this thread before I switched my white widow x big bud to 1212 I reckon I could have got it to clone after all

    Sent from a large dark place on the internet...

     

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