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Omfg! Dont do it!!! This is coming from the guy with a vortex brewer! Dont do it!!! Build your own EWC and use that. Dont dump all your cash into that money pit! Im not saying that it cant be good, but im saying that its not so great that its worth $1200 for a gallon of earth compound. Yeah fukkin right!!!!!!! $30 for 16 total oz of tea ingredients? thats fukkin insaine in my opinion...
I'm basically trying to get opinions on the tea itself, I have someone local brewing it and offering it to me for $1 a gallon. I was going to grab some right then, but he said the current batch wasn't showing much life yet.
It is basically an in store advertisement for the brewer and ingredients, I tend not to trust ad campaigns but they are willing to put the tea under the scope at the time of purchase if I want. I'm not looking for the long haul, just something to keep me "alive" while I wait for my own vermicompost setup.
while skimming through the page, this stood out to me. this proves their bullshit. i wouldn't give that company any of my money, even if it was only $1. -OSUB
But if they prove high amounts of microbial life at the time of purchase how can it not be worth a stupid dollar a gallon? They're the ones paying the big money...
Jerry, those are my thoughts exactly!! Looking at the ingredients I see no problems, just wanted to see what opinions were held by others here. This is the first commercially available product I have seen that contains yarrow, horsetail, dandelion, and a plethora of other organic goodies that are difficult to obtain during a Michigan winter!!
Dubb Sicc, would you know what to look for if they put the tea under a 'scope? This would concern me. Is it due to the ingredients used, or the skill of the tea maker?
Weed, I honestly have no idea what to look for. He insists he can show me what to look for, but that's part of why I brought it up here. His reasoning for no life was that it was just mixed, he said I won't want it too early or too late, which made sense to me. I appreciate any and all input!!
Dubb Sicc Stick 4 or 5 cups of worm castings into 5 gallons water. Add about 1/4 cup of Kelp meal and the same amount of Alfalfa meal. Stir with a stick. Repeat as often as you can - like maybe every 3 or 4 hours. Next day dump it on your soil. HTH LD
A visit to microbeorganics.com will provide you with lots of visual references to what a well made microbe laden tea should look like. Generally speaking it takes 24 to 48 hours to make a good mix. The advice given by LumperDawgz above is as good as it gets.
LD, much appreciated, that is similar to what I've been doing with air instead of stirring. My only concern is that the wiggle worm castings I am currently using are a bit less than ideal. Weed, thanks for the link! I will have to get more in depth when I get home to my pc.
It's about progress - not perfection. You'll find better castings down the road. You can go to the bank on this one, someone selling an ACT brew for $1.00 a gallon either doesn't know what they're doing or it's made using marginal compost or worm castings. Try and find a place that sells worms - not worm castings, per se. Worm breeders feed they're worms great food stock and the castings are a side business. That's been my experience anyway. HTH LD
Even if the worms werent being fed the ingredients you'd like just the beneficial bacteria and fungi produced from an aerated tea will be what you really want. Not all the hocus pocus stuff that they're trynna sell you for way too much. If you have an aerator (air pump and stone) do that! you'll be just fine!
Hey Dubb; The clips I've linked to will show you what to look for. There are very few hydro shop owners who have the integrity to check microscopically but there are a few and kudos to them if they do it correctly. If they show you a bunch of things squirming without knowing the basic groups, that is not an illustration of good ACT. If someone is selling compost tea, especially if they claim to follow it with a microscope, they should be able to show you something similar to the following. The following clips demonstrate the changes that an aerated compost tea (ACT) goes through over time. Please excuse my unusual form of narration. Note that the following ‘brews' were all made using simple ingredients as itemized on my webpage (good finished but fresh vermicompost at 2.38%, black strap molasses at 0.50%, fish hydrolysate at 0.063%, feed grade kelpmeal [not necessary!] at less than 0.25%, soft rock phosphate [not necessary!] at 0.063%) Lately I have been making ACT successfully using only vermicompost and molasses. First at 18 hours, the early stages of a brew, normally we see the development/division of bacteria/archaea and the growth of fungal hyphae. If one is seeking a fungal brew for some reason, this is the time to use it. http://microbeorganics.com/18hrs2vcfree.wmv In the following clip I identify an amoeba as a naked type but in retrospect it may be an active testate amoeba. http://microbeorganics.com/18hrs3vcfree.wmv Usually some time between 24 and 40 hours flagellates and/or naked amoebae excyst (hatch out) and begin dividing every 2 to 4 hours so the population increases rapidly. Flagellates are the small globe-like creatures moving about. They are larger than bacteria/archaea but normally smaller than ciliates. It is the flagellates in ACT which are mainly responsible for cycling nutrients to your plants. As they eat bacteria/archaea they excrete ionic (available) form nutrients to the roots. Amoebae and ciliates also contribute to this but too many ciliates can be a sign that there may be an abundance of anaerobic bacteria and the ‘brew' is on its way (or has gone) downhill. http://microbeorganics.com/36hrsvcfree.wmv At 42 hours we still have a good ‘brew' and this is often the stage I usually apply it at but I recommend 36 hours to folks who do not use a microscope. You can see that ciliates have come to life by the presence of the beautiful vorticella. http://microbeorganics.com/42hrsvcfree.wmv Finally, at 60 hours takes a very efficient machine and good monitoring with microscope and O2 meter to ensure good quality. Although it is not stressed in the narration one can see the increasing presence of ciliates whizzing around out of focus. These are normally larger and faster than flagellates and can indicate the presence of too many anaerobic bacteria. Usually if the ‘brew' is continued on past this point it degrades rapidly, with ciliates and anaerobic bacteria dominating. http://microbeorganics.com/60hrsvcfree.wmv As long as there are much greater numbers of flagellates and/or naked (active) amoebae than ciliates there is no worry because ciliates also cycle nutrients. It is possible to run a perpetual ‘brew' but there will always be a down cycle where undesirable organisms dominate until the new [vermi]compost and foodstock kicks in (starts being consumed and the correct microbial groups begin multiplying again) and homeostasis is established. I have seen this down cycle persist for at least 24 hours. If one is selling tea to customers from a perpetual ‘brew', how do you decide which customer(s) gets the inferior ‘tea'. There are people who did the testing of perpetual brews a number of years ago and assuming that ACT is about achieving a consortium of diverse nutrient cycling microorganisms, they concluded there is greater efficacy achieved by starting a new ‘brew' each time. Those who advocate the perpetual brew support their method by alluding to some mysterious hidden diversity which one can not know about without DNA testing. This is complicating the use of ACT and [vermi]compost far beyond its simple form and use within the microbial nutrient loop. They are confusing bacteria and archaea which fix nitrogen (and other nutrients) with the nutrient cycling previously described, wherein nutrients are cycled by protozoa feasting on bacteria/archaea and excreting bioavailable nutrients taken up by roots. The diversity we are looking for are bacteria/archaea and flagellates (and amoebae) mainly. Fungal hyphae provides an ongoing food resource, binds soil aggregates, provides microbial pathways, degrades organic matter and increases moisture and O2 holding capacity. There is no mystery here, no specialty agents (although there could be) and it is as easy to see that diversity, with a microscope as it is looking for robins, sparrows and crows in your back yard with binoculars. The folks who are perpetuating this mystery bunk to advocate perpetual brews, as far as I can tell, do so to line their pockets. They do not appear to back up their statements with data and criticize other ‘brewer' sellers who do. They entice hydro shop owners by illustrating how they can price gouge their customers. Amusingly they also state on their site that one should not ‘brew' beyond 24 hours because the microbes must be applied hungry…..Yikes! Can you tell it riles me? By the way I hate the terms ‘compost tea' and ‘brew' but I guess we are stuck with them.
Microbeman's advice is as good as it gets, from what I can tell, when talking about making compost brews. Likewise and I'll support any efforts to develop better nomenclature. Microbe Milkshake anyone?
Microbe moonshine? Wouldnt that imply that it is an anerobic fermentation? Microbe milkshake actually sounds delicious but we dont use any milk? Unless you add some lacto to that? Nobody even bags their compost any more so even the term tea wouldnt be appropriate... How about microbe soup? Lmao. I dono just a thought lol.