Can we make our reality a fantasy, like a lucid dream?

Discussion in 'Religion, Beliefs and Spirituality' started by TheJourney, Dec 30, 2011.

  1. What is it that makes the idea of lucid dreaming so attractive? I would say the attractions include the fact that there are no consequences to your actions, and no guilt. This is aided by the fact that there aren't, in truth, any other people, that you would have to worry about reacting negatively or thinking bad about you. The other aspect is that it is not “real.” This concept of “reality” does a lot in terms of holding us back from deriving maximum enjoyment out of life. If we want to make our actual lives more exciting, like a lucid dream, we should seek to employ, as much as we can, these same conceptions into our waking life. Feel no guilt for anything you have done, are doing, or will do. Do not think of consequences whatsoever. Remove the conception of “other people” in your reality. If there are no other people, then there is no risk of negative reaction by others; there is only your own negativity, which is easily avoided if the idea of there being other people is removed. We must also detach from our notions of reality, or what is real.

    There is a great distinction between fantasy and reality; we always prefer fantasies. Our notions of reality prevent us from making these fantasies reality, and often prevent us from even enjoying our fantasies in our heads. A fantasy is perfect; no fault can be found in a fantasy. Problems only arise when the fantasy is contrasted with the reality. Reality should be seen as being in quotes, a term used only because it is the term commonly used; it has no real meaning. It is an arbitrary term referring to an unreal and arbitrary concept. Fantasy need not be put in quotations; a fantasy is perfect. The only flaw one could find in a “fantasy” is that it is opposed to reality. Remove this distinction by removing belief in “real things,” or “the real world.” Then there is only fantasy. You still inhabit reality, but now you clearly understand that “reality” is an unreal concept, only used because it is common.
     
  2. hrmm.. some people may see you as a selfish dickhead... oh wait they dont really exist anymore! interesting theory... let us know how it works out for ya.
     
  3. Perhaps lucid dreaming isn't as unreal as we think. If, on some level, everything we experience is real, then there's no reason not to bring your sense of self and morality into any experience you have.

    I remember my first lucid experience felt more like a training ground. Almost like because this was the first time I was experiencing this state of consciousness, I'd more than likely do whatever I wanted as a result (I did just that, especially with some of the female characters I came across :rolleyes:), but I quickly came to realise that these states of being could be just as real as my waking reality, and the people I came across, interacted with, should be given the same level of respect I'd give those I met while awake.

    This is the difference between seeing them as internal dreams, and altered states of consciousness.
     
  4. I would say living in fantasy land would be fine and dandy if you just wanted to play for the rest of your life....

    ...how do you give back to humanity when you are living in a dream world?

    The ultimate self-absorption.
     

  5. That is the flip side of the coin. If reality is seen to be a dream, then dreams must be seen to be reality. It's funny, when you put it into words like that. I personally feel that the emphasis should be put on the dream/fantasizing aspect, because dreams and fantasies are free of concepts of limitation. I think that you should strive to truly and completely see life in this manner, as a dream or fantasy, first. Once you are truly able to do that, then it would be good and helpful to explore the flip side of the coin; if reality is a dream, a fantasy, then dreams and fantasies are reality.
     
  6. I would respond to this in two ways. First and most simply, it depends on what your fantasies are. My absolute ideal reality, my perfect fantasy, includes me helping humanity as much as I can possibly imagine. Helping humanity is part of my fantasy; it is, in fact, probably the most integral part. The second aspect is this; these ideas of fantasies being "selfish," as seems to be the default reaction, is only a temporary phenomena. Whatever these selfish fantasies are you are imagining, would they hold that same tantalizing pull over you forever? Or once you indulged, would it not have such a hold on you? I believe that allowing ourselves to indulge in our fantasies is the greatest tool in removing their debilitating pull over us. This frees up vast amounts of energies to allow us to do more "useful" things, in a way that we are completely absorbed in them, and satisfied.
     
  7. hrmm..

    I have vivid dreams all the time.. and have hella mad bouts of Deja vu all the fucking time. It is horribad... its almost like being clairvoyant.. but more shitty cause i can only control my reality... the shit that happened in my dreams can only be explained by multi verse cross connection of consciousness. My relief to all this for the past 3 years has been drugs...

    You can never avoid being on this plane man... your in this universe to affect and change the rifts in this universes goals. We are essentially all connected by something unseen, you are i and i am you.. your move affects me in some way and i you. Ignoring us wont make your life any better.
     
  8. #8 TheJourney, Dec 30, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 30, 2011
    Exactly. When I say "other people don't exist," I merely mean that they are representations of me, and not separate. If they are me, then how can I treat them badly? It would be treating me badly. I should treat them good, and try to make them happy and joyful, correct? So if I should try to make others happy and joyful, because they are me, then doesn't it follow that I should make myself happy and joyful too?

    These(quite natural) assumptions of selfishness at the expense of others are only the result of not following this logic all the way through. I would not, indeed can not, harm others. It is senseless! They are me! I should do everything I can to make others happy. Yet I must pursue my own happiness with the same tenacity that I try to make others happy. I must forgive others for everything, past, present and future. So too I must forgive myself for everything, past, present and future. After all, am I not them?
     
  9. It seems that we are talking about two different things then....you are actually just talking about an ideal reality.
     
  10. You are not fully them.. or I... you are stuck in your form... you are you, and yes your actions will dictate those around you. If you choose to live life like the happiest person ever... i am sure you will find the doors to the joys you so seek will open for you, but beware other bits of you, i , and they are every bit as self centered to get their needs and wants met through any way necessary, thus we have the notion of good and evil, when it is just a matter of what side of the fence you live on. Human kind has not changed over thousands of years.. read some religious material, any one, it dosent matter they all depict human behavior to some degree, and everyone came to a set of rules that everyone must abide by.

    Thus we have laws... without it those seeking self gratification will fuck over anyone and anything to get it, because they live in your fantasy world, just on the other side of the same coin.
     


  11. Naw i smell what he is steppin in. Its complex, and he is just tryin to find a piece of heaven in a place that is motivated by selfishness. Ever since you were born you have done nothing but be selfish. You took a breath and thus your need and will to live made you do something entirely selfish. From then on any action you have ever taken has been out of self motivated gratification... sometimes dissatisfaction. Sometimes that satisfaction is brought to you by others selfish motives, and sometimes dissatisfaction is also brought by others.

    We live in a world that is give an take... some have taken alot, while others suffer with nothing. Life is a bitch and your just tryin to get by like all of us.
     
  12. #12 TheJourney, Dec 30, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 30, 2011
    Another point I would like to make, that is general, and yet is probably perfect for this thread. The teachings and progression required by different individuals differ based on natural dispositions. For many people, perhaps most people, they need to be told and have it re-enforced that they need to treat others well, and not be selfish. This is because their natural disposition is towards selfishness, and that needs to be balanced. For me, my natural tendency is selflessness. I have always been great to everyone, and done everything for them. Being good to others is not a problem for me; it is, in fact, difficult for me to not be this way. Thus, as I have progressed towards understanding the true nature of reality, I have found it especially useful to understand and elaborate on the implications in terms of self-fulfillment and pursuing my own joy. It is an assumption, a natural part of my being, that I treat others well. What is important for me is to try to make myself happy to the same degree that I try to make others happy. This is why many of my writings emphasize this. That being said, my logic also necessarily implies treating others in the same way. This is generally very clear in my writings. I suppose for many people, they need the aspect of treating others well to be the primary focus. For me, it is opposite.
     
  13. I am new and have not read your other writings. Understanding who you are is great, and wanting to taste a little joy is also great. Sound to me like you just feel like you have missed out on somethin and have taken on a stance of what about me. Thats cool man, everyone needs to look out for number one... its inevitable.

    I dont think your a selfish jerk, but that seems to be a little bit of what you want to try out. Its cool man.. do what makes you happy, but be wary that others are exactly the same as you... and are the same as you want to be.

    I dunno maybe im wrong..
     

  14. nuff said
     
  15. I like this. Its a good explanation to not give a rats ass what other people think about and just live in the moment.

    But there will be consequences. Minor or major there's gonna be some and we still have to point them out because if we didn't, how could we improve ourselves? Living life mistake free with a perspective as if nothing matters can only be acted out to a certain extent. It makes life less worrisome and more fun and enjoyable but we still need to have some control of our thoughts and actions
     
  16. i feel when i dream ive been in deep sleep. never lucid deep though, just memories of events and my earliest dream ever i remember vividly.
     
  17. There are times when I get a really bad nightmare and all of a sudden my cell phone in the "real world" goes off. I begin to realize it's just a dream and am able to create whatever I need to defeat my antagonist in the dream.

    It can be difficult to just act and believe that nobody is real: Maybe we need to recognize a sign in this world to help give us a boost. :)
     
  18. TheJourney the timing of this thread is blowing my mind!!
    ive been realizing that dream and waking consciousness are ultimately one in the same...with intent we can manifest anything we want during either
     
  19. manifest me a frackin sammich
     

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