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Calcium Carbonate Foliar Spray...?


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#1
cazmeron

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Does anyone have any experience with CalCarb by Xtreme Gardening; What is CalCarb? | Xtreme Gardening

or anything like it?

Here's what the site claims;

"Calcium Carbonate Foliar Spray is Xtreme Gardening’s revolutionary calcium carbonate foliar spray which increases CO2 levels from 0.03 vol% (atmospheric level) to 0.1 vol% – the optimal level desired by plants"

"CalCarb is a proprietary calcium carbonate (CaCo3) which infiltrates plant leaves through the stomata. Once inside the intercellular space, it is converted into CO2 and CaO. CO2 increases photosynthesis levels, while the calcium strengthens the cell walls"

"Also, because plants utilizing CalCarb recieve carbon dioxide via the intercellular space, the stomata of the leaves no longer have to remain open trying to fixate it atmospherically. The stomata can now remain closed, significantly lowering transpiration and effectively increasing plant water retention by up to 75%!"

Sounds somewhat promising... Does any one have a legitimate opinion on this kind of foliar spray?

#2
Kali King

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Yeah I saw this magazine with their products in there. They claim the craziest shit. Honestly their claims are so ridiculous that I wont try there products till someone else I know uses it with success.

#3
cazmeron

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The only reason i was even considering this is because they were gunna be in the bay area and offering 25% off their products. Are they the only company with calcium carbonate sprays? Does anyone know if this even a real type of foliar spray? Can anyone back any of their claims?

#4
thaSPACEkadet

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Hey I was a hydro shop recently looking for one of those xhale bags of Co2, the guy working there referred me to that Cal/Carb spray.

He said to spraying it under the leafs work best. Idk man try it out. It's probably better than messing around with home made Co2 bottles all day.

#5
cazmeron

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Ya i've been looking at the same things. Its this Cal/Carb Stuff, the exHale thing that i dont want to pay shipping for, or some yeast shit which doesnt even sound worthwhile :/. Im too small of an op to go for a propane thing. I mean, it sounds kinda legit i guess. and its not thaaat expensive since CO2 is pretty important...

#6
AgMan

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I've been more than pleased with my Xtreme Gardening results. Higher yield, taste, smell, high, and 1 week shortened flower. I yield 40oz (34 of size, 6 for hash), in 8 weeks on 3ft tall plants. This was 3 weeks into flower when I made the change, I'm expecting more from the next rounds, they vegged with XG and are much fuller with more colas.

I can't say if CalCarb works as claimed since I changed everything at once, but the science is sound.

The following is CO2 to Carbonate but all reactions are reversible.

Solution:

CO2(atmospheric) ⇌ CO2(dissolved)
Conversion to carbonic acid:

CO2(dissolved) + H2O ⇌ H2CO3
First ionization:

H2CO3 ⇌ H+ + HCO3− (bicarbonate ion)
Second ionization:

HCO3− ⇌ H+ + CO3−− (carbonate ion)

#7
AgMan

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BTW, my plants noticeable perk up after CalCarb.

I think it's ideal in my setup since gaseous CO2 supplementation will not work in my room since it exchanges the entire air volume every 50sec...

#8
AgMan

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Some pics...

Attached Thumbnails

  • image.jpg
  • image1.jpg
  • image2.jpg


#9
cazmeron

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Wow man! not too shabby...

I got a handful of free samples that were leftovers from a hydro shop expo or something. I couldn't reaally tell whether they did much. You throw these little tea bag things filled with the CalCarb stuff into a spray bottle. I could have been doing it wrong but ill definitely get them going earlier for my next grow. I used it like once at week 6-7 or so.

thanks for the chemistry on that too. i still think the extreme gardening marketing is a circus but as long as they have products to back it up, i may be making an investment i suppose

Edited by cazmeron, 19 July 2011 - 01:43 AM.


#10
doobiesnacks69

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Thanks man i'm gonna try it out.

#11
dunny

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please do not buy "CalCarb." it sounds completely preposterous at the worst and expensive at best.

i wish people would at least wiki stuff before buying it:
Calcium carbonate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"CalCarb" is just lime... can be had for stupid cheap on ebay:
1 lb Micro-White Calcium Carbonate Limestone Free Ship | eBay

and for the claims of increasing CO2 levels? just a brief skim of the wiki shows that CO2 is released from CaCO3 only when you add a strong acid to it (HCl), or heat it to 1,544 degrees... adding water like they do will give you... calcium bicarbonate aka baking soda. lol? so in essence they're saying spraying baking soda on our plants will increase the amount of available CO2... um... right on.

AgMan is clearly working for Xtreme Gardening spewing psuedo science in hopes it'll go over your head. those chemical reactions he posted aren't even relevant to the product, its regarding carbonated water. Posting generic shots of a weed garden for additional cred always works apparently.

#12
elbowslanger

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^ What he said. Also calcium carbonate can also be Oyster Shell powder or Egg shells powder. Shit instead of adding water to get calcium bicarbonate why don't you just add 3 parts apple cider vinegar..let it sit for about 3 weeks and you can get you some cheap cal so you can save $17.99 and not have to purchase a pint of cal/mag.

#13
cazmeron

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Yea the thought struck my mind that this guys not exactly legit looking despite his decent pix, i was just trying to be nice. Also, I haven't checked the product ingredients, but it could be a decent product if there was more than calcium carbonate in it (ie. a slow release source of acid). One last point I have to make in CalCarb's defense (not that i am convinced of its benefits) but how is the website able to claim that it "increases CO2 levels from 0.03 vol% (atmospheric level) to 0.1 vol%". Anyways, i've heard shit reviews of all their other crap so this comes as no surprise lol.

edit: elbowslanger, I think you may be mixing up the purpose of this spray, as its advertised as a co2 supply sorta. i got some oyster shell and egg shells for my cal supply tho, good stuff

Edited by cazmeron, 19 July 2011 - 01:59 AM.


#14
AgMan

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No I don't work for RTI or XG, I just got some free samples at a show and loved the product. That is my room and my plants using XG products. I went from a 3-4oz average per plant to a 6-7oz average per plant (~3ft tall at harvest), and I'm expecting a higher yield in the next round due to much bushier plants from longer use of XG in veg.

Baking soda contains sodium, I don't think all that sodium is going to help your plants if you use it. Likewise, if you can even find it, pure bicarbonate would be slightly basic, probably not good for a plant either.

The product you found on eBay looks to be finely ground and would most likely work the same way. Although, the Al Marbaie Group that produces MicroWhite is out of Saudi Arabia; I prefer buying more locally than that, but do as you please. Still doesn't negate the potential.

Acid is mere a measure of free H+ (not necessarily HCl), there is plenty of H+ in the cells of all living things. H+ has a much stronger affinity to CO3 than does Ca2+, when the H+ displaces Ca2+ you get HCO3- (bicarbonate). Plants can make use of HCO3- through anhydrase...

What do you think CO2 is in a plant, a gas? Of course it gets dissolved in water, in the form of carbonic acid (H2CO3), then to bicarbonate (HCO3-).


Studies have shown that increased CO2 leads to fewer stomata developing on plants which leads to reduced water usage. (F. Woodward and C. Kelly (1995). "The influence of CO2 concentration on stomatal density". New Phytologist 131 (3): 311–327.)

I find it amusing how quick everyone on these forums are to criticize, yet how reluctant you are to actually experiment, and post something meaningful...

#15
AgMan

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For reference:

In my pics, the back row just started week 7 (43 days old), and they are 2 weeks apart on each row (starting 7, 5, 3, and 1 as you work from back to front).

#16
AgMan

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Dunny must work for eBay or Saudi Arabia since he is touting their products...

See how that works both ways?

Edited by AgMan, 19 July 2011 - 10:55 PM.


#17
AgMan

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Wow man! not too shabby...

I got a handful of free samples that were leftovers from a hydro shop expo or something. I couldn't reaally tell whether they did much. You throw these little tea bag things filled with the CalCarb stuff into a spray bottle. I could have been doing it wrong but ill definitely get them going earlier for my next grow. I used it like once at week 6-7 or so.

thanks for the chemistry on that too. i still think the extreme gardening marketing is a circus but as long as they have products to back it up, i may be making an investment i suppose


I have two suggestions:

One is from the package that says spray the underside of leaves (where the stomas are located).

The second is not in the directions but should be, spray before the lights come on. Stomas are fully open at night, a partially open during the day. I think it is best to apply this at night so it is absorbed more effectively.

Edited by AgMan, 19 July 2011 - 11:18 PM.


#18
AgMan

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AgMan is clearly working for Xtreme Gardening spewing psuedo science in hopes it'll go over your head. those chemical reactions he posted aren't even relevant to the product, its regarding carbonated water. Posting generic shots of a weed garden for additional cred always works apparently.


This sounds like it is coming from a guy who took high school chemistry, failed, and thinks he knows all there is to know about chemistry. It is obvious that you do not...

#19
cazmeron

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I find it amusing how quick everyone on these forums are to criticize


Alright, well i tried to go light on you, but in any case, you do need to realize that it is VERY EASY to be doubtful of your post due to the very fact that you had 7 previous posts.

yet how reluctant you are to actually experiment, and post something meaningful...


This thread exists because I know that buying marketing is easier than manufacturing quality. HANDS DOWN. ESPECIALLY in the consumer agricultural products. Furthermore, this thread exists because i, like anyone, don't wanna get hustled like many MJ growers do when they buy into ridiculously overpriced products that are marketed to make them look like they are more than what they actually are. [ie. Selling

Lets take a look at Xtreme Gardening's Marketing....

"Xtreme Gardening’s revolutionary calcium carbonate foliar spray"


"CalCarb utilizes a new form of nanotechnology"


"Often, viewed initially with skepticism and deemed the most unbelievable” of all the products in the Xtreme Gardening Line"


Don't give us shit for being critical of this bullshit and not "actually experiment[ing], and post[ing] something meaningful...[myself]"

I'm not a dumb consumer

Moreover, you look particularly phishy when you can drop that much knowledge on this CalCarb shit, especially when considering the age of this post and the number of previous posts you've had, AND the very rhetoric of your comments. But whether you are or aren't puppet, i really don't care. All i care about is my question that has yet to be answered, which will ultimately determine whether i'll buy this or not;

How can the manufacturer back this claim;

"increases CO2 levels from 0.03 vol% (atmospheric level) to 0.1 vol%"


So AgMan, if you are a puppet (don't be shy, you wouldn't be the first), please insight be on this ONE detail so i can go out any by this product with confidence.

Edited by cazmeron, 19 July 2011 - 11:20 PM.


#20
cazmeron

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One last thing, I understand you're new here so it's ok, but please remember these wise words from the respected RMJL,

Negative comments are one thing, suggestions are another and constructive criticism is yet another thing....HATE...not welcome...HATERS...not welcome.


It is what it is.


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