No political philosophy has it all sussed 100% but Libertarians are a lollipop with many flavors and i find the more you suck the more sense it makes and the better it tastes...
Yes... Perhaps i could have phrased that a little better... Just in case --- what i meant was at first i was very skeptical of the Libertarian ideals (we dont have Libertarians in Europe really) but a lot of it makes sense and i just looooove their stance on US foreign policy... A Libertarian led US would change the world for the better... Go Ron Paul... [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-t_YD-sDhw&feature=related[/ame]
sounds like all the above posts on page 1-3 was describing communism.... i seen a mention to KARL MARX,,,,,and i agree,, libertarians are the exact opposite of what communism stands for,,,, PERHAPS JIMI THING is a communist,,and has issues with the libertarian philosophy.... .............
Perhaps. I toured the Museum of Communism recently. He would definitely like their message more than a Libertarians. Sounds like we still use this playbook?
Who'da thunk !? On a more serious note, i think europe is going to be hitting a wall soon in which they realize one of two things. A.When it comes to socialism it has to be COMPLETE ... you can't have a government which is socialist only in ways that benefits people ... as if the governments in Europe don't already have enough control, they will have to take MORE to make sure things pan out evenly, and honestly i have no faith that it would even if they do shift to full on communism. B. Same as above
Bailouts started when we left the Bretton Woods standard and became 100% fiat, and in 1970 and 1971 we bailed out Penn Central Railroad ($3.2 billion) and Lockheed ($1.7 billion). After 9/11 we did a bailout for the airline industry ($18.6 billion).
You are correct in that Europe is more pink than red... Watered down Socialism... The Dems and Reps (NeoCons) in the US are as pink as most European governments at this stage... Communism is as feared in Europe as the US and will never take root...
The thing i like about anarchist libertarians is that the don't pretend like everything can be good. You would think europeans, who have seen much more of humanity screwed up ( as they are older than the united states) would have given in to this fact a long time ago. Socialism in its nature implies that there is a state of existence that is possible for humanity to attain in which everything works out to be fair. I personally reject the concept of this. I think maybe people who are advocates of socialist governments believe that the goal ... whether attainable or not, is worth working for. Kind of a "shot for the stars and if you fail you still might make it to the moon" mentality.
Thanks man, I thought I'd heard something about a Harley Davidson bailout once, too, I should start googling!
I was looking forward to waking up today and finding that some good arguments had taken place in this thread... come on Jimi (or anyone else who is willing to argue his side)
i just had a similar argument with a co-worker. i think anti-libertarian ideas deflate a bit when they realize that in a libertarian society there is nothing stopping you from organizing a socialism, or a communism, and there is nothing stopping you from organizing any form of collectivism. the only bit you can't do is force someone else to take part in your little collectivist paradise. if people want to voluntarily give half of their income to an agency that takes care of them, more friggin power to them. but if you want to force people to take part in your shenanegins, just cause you out number those who don't, then you don't really understand the word liberty.
Most people who want it DO NOT. Oh wait I just deleted your whole post and commented on wht I wanted to. Geez I hope garrison doesn't come in here and ridicule me.
Indeed... Libertarians are everyones friend... As a Socialist i found the Libertarian philosophy hard to get my head around at first but as you say there is nothing to stop a Socialist society existing in a Libertarian world.. The NeoCon is the common enemy... Stop them and anything is possible...