Hey guys, Just started making BHO. Hoping someone can help me wrap my head around the process of vac purging in a way that is easy to understand (I'm not a chemist...) I have a basic idea, but my main question is: After the initial muffin is pulled and the chamber is brought to the desired vac pressure, How is the butane escaping, or 'purging' from the patty if the chamber is completely sealed (both valves shut) with the negative pressure? Is the butane simply trapped in the chamber, outside of the patty, to escape once the lid is finally opened? To my knowledge, most people only run the pump until the desired vac pressure is reached, not for the entire purging process of 24ish hours. Also the pump I bought states that it should not be run more than 5 minutes at a time. Did I just buy a shitty pump? Are you supposed to be running the pump the whole time you are purging? Also I am trying to end up with a 'pull and snap' consistency at room temp, not a gooey consistency. It's my understanding that keeping your temp at 90 will keep it more stable, but that you may need to winterize to get what I'm looking for. And can you winterize and still do decent sized batches? I'm not trying to mess around with hours of work and end up with a few razor blade scrapings... I finally read a thread where people were talking about winterizing THEN vac purging, assuming that you could do larger batches than the method that I've seen on YouTube called 'absolute shatter' (where they end up with a few grams). I'm trying to do batches of 50-70 grams finished product, using about a pound of material at a time... My first run is in the chamber right now, been in for a little over 30 hours at 89-92 degrees and -29hg. Flipped it 3 times, about every 8 hours. Any input is appreciated. Thanks
I'm a bit tired so I might be able to help you out more in depth later but I typically run my pump as long as I can, I usually just turn it off when I leave or go to sleep. I dont think its bad to give the pump a rest for a couple hours but those hvac pumps are built to run. What pump did you get? I've never seen that on a pump before. Your final consistency is more dependent on the material/strain and your tech. Some strains make shatter, some make sap, some make pull-n-snap. If you winterize or dewax it will also change consistency. But if you want your oil to stay clear and not budder up then start with low temps, around 80-85 if possible. Then bump up your temps little by little as necessary, if it seems like its too stiff then you'll need a little more heat to break the surface tension of the oil. Dewaxing or winterizing is most definitely possible in large quantities. Would you be doing dual-solvent winterizing with ethanol or single-solvent just using butane? I've made 50-60g dewaxed slabs with simple equipment like a couple 1/2gal mason jars, dry ice and some coffee filters. I would try to go 50-72hr at those temps.
Thanks, Jimmy. Good to know about the pump. I DID go for an extreme budget version (best value vacs 3cfm single stage, bought a package deal with the chamber), as I am on an extreme budget until I harvest next, but screw it I'm just going to run that sucker for hours and see what happens. Planning on buying a better, bigger one eventually anyways... Thanks for the info. Gonna stay at low temps I think. Just brought it up to 95 for a few minutes as that what I read in this thread: http://dudegrows.com/how-to-make-bho-step-by-step-... I was thinking that I would need to do a dual solvent process, using butane and 95% everclear. Would you be able to walk me through the steps of how you did a larger batch and dewaxing? Also someone else was talking about integrating a vacuum into this process? Are you familar with this? I appreciate the info, brother.
The vacuum you're probably thinking of is for use with a buchner funnel, I have a small one with a 500mL flask so I can't filter all that much at once without having to dump it and keep going. So sometimes on larger runs I just pour it through coffee filters held by stainless strainers. Since you're planning on doing dual-solvent winterizing then you can use your vac pump to power it, when using butane I would highly suggest you avoid using the vac pump because those butane vapors are explosive. I use a water powered faucet aspirator from Amazon to run it when doing single-solvent runs with butane. [/IMG] You could either blast into a couple large pyrex measuring cups or 1/2gal mason jars, I like the mason jars personally and would probably be better for you since it has a lid to keep it sealed up in the freezer. After you have all your material blasted, pour in your everclear slowly and it will begin to boil off all the tane. I dont ever do dual-solvent runs so I dont remember the ratio of everclear:butane to use, I want to say 2:1 so if you had 600ml butane you would pour in 300ml of everclear. There is a Winterizing/Dewaxing thread around here where you'll find the exact amount of everclear to pour in. Anyway, once you have your everclear poured in, stir it around for a couple minutes to be sure all the butane has been boiled off and then seal it up and throw it in the freezer or even put it on dry ice. With dry ice you could freeze it for 6-12hr and it should be done but if you use your freezer it will probably take 24-36hr since it doesnt get anywhere near as cold as dry ice. If you dont have a buchner funnel then setup a couple strainers over your pyrex dish somehow and put a coffee filter or two in them and pour it through. then evaporate the alcohol with little to no heat, this will take a while but it will preserve flavor. Then just continue purging as you usually would.
Awesome, Jimmy! Thanks for the detailed info on winterizing in larger batches. So I've been running my pump in 15 minute intervals, then turning it off until the motor is cool to the touch, about another 15 minutes. I'm assuming this is not nearly enough vaccing, as I still get 'action'. I've flipped it a total of 6 times now, keeping it around 90-92 degrees. It's been almost 48 hours total in the chamber with -29hg, but out of that time the pump has only been running maybe a few hours. I am apprehensive to run this pump constantly, as this is what is stated on the product info: •Customers using solvents such as stabilization resins (Cactus Juice™, MinWax™, Gator Venom™ etc.), alcohol and other polar solvents must use the vacuum pumps in conjunction with a cold trap for evacuations in excess of 5 minutes.•If the consumer is using the pump for prolonged periods of time exceeding 5 minutes we require that a cold trap is used or the pump warranty is void.•These stabilization resins have the ability to break down the internal components of the pump that are plastic resulting in a seized motorvoiding all warranties. •When evacuation exceeds 5 minutes these solvents begin to vaporize and then re-condense in the vacuum pump reservoir. Once enough solvent re-condenses in the pump displacing the oil the plastic internal components may begin to warp, melt or seize. The use of a cold trap will condense the vapors prior to making their way to the vacuum pump preventing pump damage due to excessive use. Furthermore, Minwax Wood Hardener™ is not to be used with any vacuum pumps, EVER. (A seized motor will result within the first use.)•To prevent these issues from happening to your process, change the Oil after each vacuum pump use, Even if the use time is only 5min. I'm thinking this is just a crap pump, and since it's a few weeks until I can upgrade, I'm trying to not push it to the limit quite yet. Is this kind of manufacturer precaution normal, do you think I would be fine to just go for it and run constantly for hours...? Thanks again, Jimmy
Try and run it for an hour at least, it should be fine running that long. I'm actually using a BVV chamber kit with their pump right now, its a friend's kit, and I run the pump hours at a time. Butane is non-polar so I wouldnt worry about that too much, alcohol is a different story though. The lids on those BVV chambers are made from acrylic, which will weaken when exposed to alcohol, thats why you shouldn't use alcohol to clean your lid because it could cause it to implode over time. I would be careful when purging your alcohol extracts in it, make sure its got a decent heat purge on it before putting it in the chamber. theres minimal alcohol vapors leaving your slab at that point, we're talking PPM's. What you quoted is talking about stabilizing resins for hardening wood, like in making gun handles etc. That involves liquid solvent to be inside your chamber to be absorbed into the wood. When purging your alcohol extracts there should be minimal alcohol left in it by the time you vac purge it. I would try and do some single-solvent runs and see how you like it, theres more detailed info on it in the Winterizing/Dewaxing Thread. And yes, they are crap pumps 100% so upgrade if you can afford something good and preferrably US made. Yellow Jacket, JB Industries and Robinair are good choices, I would go with one of the first two though personally.
Good to know that you have been running the same pump! I will let it go a few hours... And thanks for the info with the alcohol purge. I appreciate the diligence with the replies! Big help. You rock.