Hello GCO, just want to talk about a few things regarding teas.. I have basically narrowed my focus to AACT's, SST's, Alfalfa meal/Kelp meal tea and Neem Seed meal/Kelp meal tea for my next run with coots soil mix which is currently being cooked up. The reason I have decided to focus on these is as follows, please let me know if I am misunderstanding something or missing something entirely. thanks! Actively Aerated Compost Teas- I plan on using these 3-4 times total; I see them as a bacterial/fungal inoculate. I used it when i initially mixed my soil up for its first soaking and am counting this towards the "3-4 times total". I see these teas as a way to ensure there is plenty of life in my soil and plan on 1-2 more applications during veg and 1-2 during flower. The recipe I have for an AACT is as follows: (aerated with 2 large air stones in a 5gal bucket w/ ecoair2 126GPH air pump for 12-36 hours. shorter for higher fungal population and longer for bacterial) 4 Gallons R/O water 4 cups locally sourced EWC 1/4 cup sulfur-free blackstrap molasses 2 tbsp liquid fish 1 tbsp liquid kelp 1/2 cup fulvic acid for foliar Sprouted Seed Teas- I have only just recently learned about these and from my understanding I should use them throughout my plants life. This is my "enzyme" tea that will aid in the breakdown of nutrients in my soil. I plan on using this while my soil is cooking to aid with the breakdown and will continue to use it once every 1 to 2 weeks until harvest. The recipe I have for a SST is as follows: 2 oz barely soaked for 8-10 hours in 1gal r/o water then drained and placed on wet cloth to rest for 8-10 hours then placed back into jug with fresh r/o water with fulvic acid added to be soaked for another 8-10 hours then drained and placed on wet cloth again. Now I would take the trey of barely on the wet cloth and place it in a paper bag to rest until a root as long as the seed sprouts. Once I get this I am now able to take the barely and puree it for a mix that can be used to make a 5 gal solution. Alfalfa meal/Kelp meal Teas- These are good during veg and up through early flower. They provide a good source of nitrogen and hormones/micro nutrients. The recipe I have for these is as follows: 4 Gallons R/O water 1 cup Alfalfa meal 1/4 cup Kelp meal Aerated for 24-36 hours 2 tsp silica 1 cup Aloe Vera juice 1/2 cup fulvic acid for foliar Neem meal/Kelp meal Teas- Don't know much about these but I do know they are good for insecticide reasons. Do these provide N as well? Not sure when I should stop using as a soil drench, obviously stop spraying in flower. the recipe I have for these is as follows: 4 Gallons R/O water 1/2 cup Neem Seed meal 1/4 cup Kelp meal Aerated for 24-36 hours 2 tsp silica 1 cup Aloe Vera juice 1/2 cup fulvic acid for foliar please let me know if I am misunderstand the use of these teas or when to use them, or if there is another ingredient/tea entirely I should know about. TYVM GCO! edit: Could I use a kelp tea with the recipe from one of the above mixes without either alfalfa of neem meal throughout the entire life cycle of the plant or is there a point that you should back off the kelp?
I only have 1 arm would you or some one who know teas to brake down to mix 1 gallon at a time thanks?
1 gallon SST: 1 oz malted barely finely ground and soaked for 4 hours, or 11gram fresh seeds sprouted 10ml fulvic 5ml protekt 1 gallon neem kelp tea: 1.6Tbs neem meal 0.8TbS kelp 1/4Tsp aloe powder (or 1/4 cup fresh) 10ml fulvic 5ml protekt 1gallon kelp tea: 1.6Tbs alfalfa 0.8Tbs kelp 10ml fulvic 5ml protekt read the No-Till thread, it will answer all your questions. (guest_over_dere = coot, guest_under_hill=bluejay)
Looks good except for the RO stipulation, stripping cal/mag/iron from your medium is never a good idea
Great, thanks for the response. yeah i am really considering abandoning the r/o water but I want to talk to some locals a bit first. I know my water is really really really bad, and it's not the pH i'm worried about. my ppms are in the 450-600 range and I know there is some nasty stuff in it, just no sure exactly what.
I'm in a similiar situation myself with my well running about 275-400. I run 50/50 tap and RO just fine, but years ago when I first got into organic cultivation I was using pure RO and had awful results with cal/mag issues and stripping the medium. Look at my posts from like 2010, I was a fucking wreck, LOL!
I've read about this on weed forums before but it doesn't make any sense to me, chemically speaking. Not saying there's no truth to it... Do you have a link or something I can read on this?
Kinda sorta, it's something that I more so came to the conclusion after understand CEC in coco with chelates. In an effort to balance out the huge amounts of naturally occuring potassium I used cal/mag nitrate to buffer the medium and tested it. Then ran straight RO water through and tested it again, noting that the Ca and Mg had been removed from the buffer.. I could 100% be wrong, but after 3 years of tweaking this, its what I've settled on until educated otherwise. The changes made reflected a huge improvement in my garden, as much as I like to think I understand what I'm talking, its really just following my gut and taking note of the changes lol.
Why only use it 4 times? I've been using mine once or more a week! If using RO then add 2.5cc cal/mag per gallon and everything will work out and nothing will be stripped. I use a cup of mulch pile dirt, a handful of ocean forest, 1tsp/gal molasses, cup of castings, tsp of azomite, high phos guano, ground alfalfa, humic acid and any digestible organic that will break down. This is areated in a sock for a few hrs up to 48. I add kelp sometimes but it won't blend. Ingredients should vary every week to include fruits (use those within 8 hrs) or the sour quickly) I'm 7 weeks into flowering and now wonder if I've been doing this all wrong? My plants are all kicking butt..
couldn't it be possible to double, triple or quadruple the recipe? so 4oz of malted barley grain, 40 ml fulvic and 4 teaspoons silica, 1 cup aloe puree into one gallon, then measure a 1/4 of that to add to 3/4 gallon of water? check the math but that should make four gallons of SST and only use a gallon to brew. that way you can just measure and mix each gallon and not have to brew four separate gallons or four simultaneously?
I do stuff like this. I'll brew up a concentrated solution in my 5-gal bucket and then dilute out to 3 other buckets. Haven't had a negative experience yet. Done it with barley, kelp, alfalfa....
got a new recipe for the AACT based off of microbe organics calculations, i just want to put it down for myself, heh. 4 gal dechlorinated water 1 1/2 cup EWC 1/3 cup black strap molasses I have been hearing/reading a lot of bad things about r/o water recently so I won't be using it anymore and am going to pick up a 10 stage water filter from amazon for ~$85 in the next few weeks. I'm going to revise all the recipes in a few days.
you'll need 2 tablespoons per gallon of fish hydrolysate for his recipes. when I brew his teas I use 1/2 c EWC, 2 shot glasses of fish hydrolysate, 2 tablespoons molasses in each gallon. 16-18 hr brew time. EWC teas are great for revitalizing a poorly mixed soil and starting out new soil. the fish hydrolysate is only there to encourage fungal growth of the tea.
The hydrosylate isn't necessary for fungal growth in an ACT, provided the starting material used ( [vermi]compost ) contained the diversity in the first place, an adequate food source (BSM) is supplied and the "brew" time is ~32 - 36 hours. From Tim's website - http://microbeorganics.com/ Aerated compost tea making is an active process which extracts microorganisms (breaks them loose from binding spots) into aerated water and provides them with a food source (foodstock) which causes them to multiply. If one is using quality compost or vermicompost (hereinafter referred to as [vermi]compost), an efficient ACT maker with sufficient aeration and the correct amount of foodstock, like black strap molasses, it is all about timing and to an extent temperature. The first microbes to begin dividing and growing in ACT are bacteria/archaea and fungi (if present in the [vermi]compost). The fungi grows out rapidly as fungal hyphae and is often attached to pieces of organic matter free floating. The bacteria/archaea can divide every 20 minutes and appear as moving (motile) or stationary (non-motile) dots, rods and long strands. Usually these organisms are seen in large volume by the 18 hour to 24 hour period of the process, which for simplicity's sake we'll call a brew (since that is the term which has been colloquially applied). In response to the population explosion of bacteria/archaea we have a congruent reactive increase in the protozoa population beginning around the 24 hour period. The usual type of protozoa which we see, given an efficient brewer is flagellates, however sometimes there will also be naked amoebae. The third type of protozoa, which we do not wish to see a ton of, are ciliates, as they can indicate the presence of anaerobic bacteria. The flagellate population can double every 2 hours so usually at the 36 hour period we have a sufficient diversity of microorganisms to call the brew finished and apply it to the soil and plants. A good temperature range is usually 65 to 75 F but unless really cold the timing estimate is quite reliable. 3/ black strap molasses (BSM) feeds both bacteria/archaea and fungi equally well contrary to what the A(A)CT aficionados were saying. The story was that BSM feeds only bacteria. This led to all sorts of misconceptions, even including ones made by USDA and Canada Agriculture scientists who declared that using molasses in ACT could lead to e-coli contamination. It is utter nonsense. Besides the testing I have done and ratifying assays carried out by KIS, it is common knowledge amongst many mycologists like Paul Stamets that BSM grows out fungal hyphae just fine. 4/ fish hydrolysate feeds both fungi and bacteria/archaea again contrary to the story at the time that it is mainly a fungal food. (I'm glad to see that story has now changed) I'm not suggesting this is the end all recipe for the purposes of an ACT, nor to blindly accept what is said here without looking into it yourself; with that said, I tend to side with the experience and accessibility Tim (Microbeman) has shown, which has been supported by more than just his word. Like everything said on the internet, take it with a grain of salt.
"Another trick to encourage fungal growth is to use good quality fish hydrolysate diluted in water (e.g. around 2 ounces per gallon of water) and dampen compost and cover for around 5 days with a cloth." microbeorganics.com in the compost tea recipe section. i thought it was just supposed to make it more fungal dominant due to Tim's statement. EWC and molasses will work as i've used just that in a slurry. hell, if we wanna get down to brass tacks, just adding EWC wet with water only will work as a top dress and i bet you can even just add that like a nonaerated sit overnight tea. as far as i understand it, the ingredients will provide different results under a microscope so that is why you're supposed to follow the tea recipe exactly so you can try and emulate Tim's results. adding casting in any way to your soil by top dress or tea is going to give you great benefits. no doubt about that.
Tim - http://microbeorganics.com/ The result of all this is that my attitude towards recipes for ACT has really evolved over the years with a trend towards the more simple. I know that there are a lot of people who place importance on creating a bacterial or fungal dominant ACT. At one time I myself was so influenced, however, the more I've learned and unlearned about living soil and a functioning microbial population interacting with plants, the more I've been led to allow the soil and plants to decide which microbes are actively needed by the rhizosphere team. What this means is that 9 times out of 10 I'm trying to create a balanced ACT with a decent ratio of the three basic microbial groups. When this hits the soil, some will go dormant to wake up later and some will be immediately put into action at the direction of the needs of the soil and plants. The exceptions to this may be if I am attempting to battle a particular pathogen and want to attack it with a heavy fungal or bacterial (or a combo) ACT. In these situations some tweaking of recipes and timing can be helpful. If attempting these variations, a microscope is really the only way to confirm the desired microbial population. I have outlined some recipes which may trend towards a certain microbial group (or combo) or may assist with certain pathogens. To each their own but I don't own a microscope to inspect my ACT with, and when I previously followed the basic "recipe" Tim outlined I experienced a desirable outcome, imo. But as far as applications go, I would use ACT to stimulate and/or introduce the microbial communities in fields, raised beds and dried out/ignored soil. IOW I look at it as a situational tool, not a regular necessity. I experienced far more beneficial responses in soil health when I shifted my focus from nutrition and secondary inputs to humus quality. As LD said before, get the compost figured out and you won't have many questions that need answering. IMO an ACT is more useful in larger sized applications than small, as I found fresh vermicompost from my bins to be more than enough for my pots.
i have barely brewed tea since coming here. i hate brewing it as i hate cleaning the brewer, setting it up and listening to the hum of the air pump. so i have always used slurries or just top dress with ewc and then water the plants. that's it. basic. i agree with you about feeding the soil and what you've said. i don't own a scope so i tend to just trust the recipe he gives because he does. tim used to add humic acid to his teas but now doesn't. i was not aware he isn't adding fish hydrolysate or advocating it's use any longer since it's not needed. i've seen him talk about fungal activity being increased using stuff like oats or the fish so there's probably something i'm not understanding which is another reason i just use the recipe he gives.
Here's my next ACT recipe I'm going to start up later this am as I will be mixing up another batch of LOS soil for some new pots. 1 cup EWC - our own home made 1 cup EWC - found in the woods this time of year 4 tbs of BSM 4-5 gallons filtered water Microbulator (Tim's version) outside with air pump covered by a 48 gal tote (keeps the noise level down) I will aerate for ~30-36 hrs then some of this into new soil the rest in my outdoor raised beds. Reason for collecting EWC in the woods: Soil and by default EWC found in the forrest will be higher in fungal hyphae than our own EWC which is higher in bacteria. We want to have a good mix of both bacteria and fungal hyphae, this mix will work. No cal/mag needed (ewc has it all as does the BSM). Also RO water will be fine here too, nothing wrong with RO water been using it for 5 years on my plants and family with great result. The only reason I don't use it in this ACT is I'm going to aerate outside and my RO rig is inside and I'm not carrying any water very far so I use the hose with a charcoal filter to rid of chlorine and some other nasties in the water that can inhibit microbial growth in the early stages of aeration. I'll report back here with a few pics of my EWC mix and the microbulator rig, it really makes a huge difference both out doors and indoors.