Highly Amended Soil, Want More

Discussion in 'Growing Organic Marijuana' started by maxlaz, Mar 26, 2015.

  1. so a while ago i purchased a book called true living organics by the rev. now from what i've seen on here (and i did read through this site before putting my soil together) you guys stick to the kiss model. he decides to go the other way with it. he basically tries to go for the largest variety of sources for all the nutrients. now i know you can get away with a bag of soil, some kelp meal and a few other things and get exactly what you want and need from it. however i really liked the idea of a large variety. so i put together that soil and it's working wonderfully. i've done more research on what else other people put into their soil and got a lot of good ideas from here. now what this post is actually about is i would like to further increase my variety with other amendments i've seen used here and a few other sources.
    after you read what's all in my soil some of you will want to say i got suckered into buying a lot of stuff i dont need, but i didn't get suckered, i did it willingly. i'm also not interested in arguements like don't use coco use peat instead. i would rather use both. i want to give my babies everything i have access to, and with the internet i have access to just about everything. 
    ok so here's my current soil mix (the rev's mixture)
    2 gal fox farm ocean forest
    2 gal coco
    2 gal perlite
    2 gal ewc
    1.5 c fertilizer
    .5 c greensand
    .75c oyster shell - powdered
    1 c oyster shell - crushed
    .5 c dolomite lime - powdered
    1.75c dolomite lime - prilled, fast acting
    .25 c bonemeal
    .25 c guano (12-12-2)
    .75 c feather meal
    1 c bone meal
    .5 c bulb food (espoma brand)
    .25 c soft rock phosphate (i actually forgot to add this, but i have it)
    .5 c gypsum - powdered
    .5 c kelp meal
    4 c composted steer manure
    .5 c azomite - granular
    1 c humic acid ore - granular
    1 c alfalfa meal
    .5 c rock phosphate - granular
    1.25 c organic basmati rice
     
    so that's my current mix, other things i currently have available:
    azomite - powdered
    bone meal - steamed
    cottonseed meal
    guano (0-5-0)
    gypsum - granular
    DE
     
    now other things i've seen recommended:
    zeolite
    crab meal
    neem meal
    vermiculite
    glacial rock dust
    dry molasses
    nettles
    yarrow
    comfrey
    dandelion
    clover
    borage
    karanja meal
    insect frass
    chitosan
    epsom salt
    mushroom compost
    peat
    bentonite
    aloe
    soybean meal
    langbeinite
    wood ash
     i would like to eventually add in all of these things so that i have the very largest variety of useful things that i can get my hands on. do any of you know of any of these that should not be mixed for some reason? ie bad chemical reaction, or giving off noxious gases or compounds bad for the microbes or the plants?
    do any of you have recommendations as to what amounts of these things i should add into my existing soil?
    i also have a few other things for teas, they include fox farm big bloom, camg+, liquid seaweed and liquid fish fertilizer.

     
  2. Just be sure and save some room for the plants. LOL

    Basmati rice!?! I buy that in 20lb sacks, but never thought to add it to my mix. LOL Jasmine perhaps, but the Basmati just shows up every now and then (in 20lb sacks anyway), and I'm not going to waste it on mere plants.

    Wet
     
  3. #3 maxlaz, Mar 26, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 26, 2015
    yeah, basmati isn't cheap, but from what i've read it and the oyster shells act kinda like rafts for the microbes to stick to and colonize around. a lot of the amendments aren't cheap. now money isn't exactly an issue, but i'm not going for the most expensive soil either so i look around anywhere that may sell stuff and compare prices. saved myself quite a bit of money by buying from different places instead of just one place that happens to have everything i need. i'm just glad summers around the corner so i can try to source some of the stuff from local nurseries that are opening for the season. i started this project at the beginning of winter, so i got stuck buying everything from big box stores and online.
     
    EDIT: part of the reason i went with basmati instead of another type of rice is that it's grown in the himilayas, a commonly accepted origin of the cannabis plant. i wanted to give it a little bit of home. also if anyone knows of things that grow in the Himilayas that may fertilize the ground there that i can also find and put into my soil i'd love to know.
     
  4. Damn, that's quite a mix! Things I would definitely try to add are the neem or karanja meals, crab meal, glacial rock, and mushroom compost(local is always better, if confirmed organic). I would stay away from ANYTHING cottonseed wise unless you can absolutely make sure it's completely organically produced, look for the OMRI logo. That's goes for ANY seed meals actually! Things like comfrey, nettles, dandelion, etc are are great if used for fpe's(fermented plant extract), or added to your compost/vermicompost piles! These types of plants are considered "nutrient accumulators". I would try to use fresh if at all possible. Fresh aloe is also good to use when watering.

    -5sF-
     
  5. a lot of my products are from espoma (including my cottonseed meal), all their bags i buy fly the omri logo. i did a bit of research into them and they seem to be legit.
    i have a lot of nettles and dandelions on my property so they'd be fresh picked. i have about 10 aloe plants at my house too so that is a reliable source since most of them have overgrown their pots. the comfrey, yarrow, clover, and borage i can all grow in my yard so those would also be nice and fresh.
    so you have any recommendation as to what amounts of these to add?
     
  6. #6 5starFailure, Mar 27, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 27, 2015
    Espoma is good shit, I would trust anything from them. I sometimes use their Gardentone as a base fertilizer then build up from there. Make sure the dandelions are true dandelions, they should have a very long taproot and be sure to pull the entire plant and root. The imposter dandelions are "false dandelion" and "asiatic hawksbeard", neither of these have a long taproot but look very similar to the real dandelion. I'm not sure if other species of nettle besides "stinging nettle" are nute accumulators(just gave myself something else to research).. Fresh aloe juice can be used at 1/4 cup per gallon as a soil drench and as a foliar feed. It's like a protein shake, it's a performance booster for your plants. Aloe can also be used as a natural rooting/cloning agent. As far as the others listed(and so many more), check out this website to learn more about fpe's.

    http://www.frenchgardening.com/tech.html?pid=3164873867231346
     
  7. I love the fact that you are striving for diversity! I'm a big believer of diversity being key as well! I'm sub'd, let us know how it turns out for ya!

    -5sF-
     
  8. 5star i'll be sure to check out that site. i tried to quick read some of the headings on there and wondered why you'd link me to a french site, but now i see the content is in english. it's also good to have some reassurance on the espoma brand. as i said i looked into them a bit, but not extensively and same with their usage. as for the dandelions, i live in the country w a few acres and a hobby farm in the family with a few hundred acres, so finding stinging nettles and other native plants isn't a problem. and i know i have both real and fake dandelions on my property. 
    and as far as how it's done so far, two splendid looking males... the first one that i turned into brownies a few weeks ago and the one i have right now i just put into flower last week but it looks like sacks at the upper nodes already. i have more bag seed sprouted under a 125w compact florescent in a smaller seedling cabinet, but they're quite young yet. it'll give me a week or so to cut that male, redo my diy carbon filter, rerig my light, and clean the room, and maybe figure out some companion plants and also get some aeration pots. anyone know of a store that sells those? i saw them on homedepot, but they're only online, steins doesn't have them. i know hydro stores have netpots and such, but do  they normally have aeration pots? they're cheap and i don't need a whole bunch of them, so i don't feel like paying for shipping on the internet anywhere. guess i can do site to store if i have to.
     
  9. "I do not recommend using dolomite lime is that it contains 2x the amount of magnesium vs. 1x of elemental calcium. That isn't to say the magnesium isn't important - quite the opposite it's extremely important but magnesium has absolutely nothing to do as far as a liming agent.

    Excessive magnesium will cause soils to bind up making it difficult for the plant's root hairs to move through the soil to exchange their hydrogen cation (+) for minerals, macro and micro nutrients.

    In plant-based soil amendments like alfalfa meal and kelp meal, a review of the levels of calcium vs. magnesium show that it's 4 and 5x - quite the opposite of dolomite lime.

    Calcium carbonate is water soluble while magnesium is not." - CC


    Check out my grow! Mars II LED & Organic No-Till Soil.
    http://forum.grasscity.com/organic-grow-journals/1318542-freedom-35.htmlk

    "So for the farmer in his work: serve nature and all is well. Farming used to be sacred work. When humanity fell away from this ideal, modern commercial agriculture rose. When the farmer began to grow crops to make money, he forgot the real principles of agriculture."
     
  10. Shit that doesn't belong in your soil! (IMO, lol)

    Dolomite Lime
    Calcium magnesium carbonate (do- lomite) is often used for liming. Dolo- mite is less soluble than calcium carbon- ate, and reacts more slowly. Dolomite supplies magnesium, a consideration if you are trying to increase magnesium content. The more magnesium applied the fewer sites you have to hold calcium. Unless your soils need additions of mag- nesium, dolomite should be avoided.


    Azomite
    Azomite (aka Montmorillite) contains a good deal of aluminum that can be chelated by humic acids in the soil, fulpower, kelp meals... and uptaken by the plant. If you were to use azomite in the proportions in which we add rock dust, this toxic metal accumulation could be a problem.
    Which means you're intaking Aluminum that deposits in your brain and leads to all kinds of mental health issues. You should be using Aluminum Free deodorant too.

    Perlite
    Is Perlite bad? No, it's a great soil aeration amendment. So why shouldn't you use it? It takes million of years to form and is harvested using strip mining techniques that are bad for the plant and the people who get paid pennies a day to preform the labor.

    Bat Guano
    Disruption of the bats natural ecosystems and the labor employed is extremely under paid along with not having the proper safety suits or breathing equipment to work in such a toxic environment.

    Blood & Bone Meals
    Both these amendments are slaughter house by products. There is no real way to ensure its a 100% clean product, could have leftover antibiotics, anti wormers, GMO's from the animal feed, and then there is the just simple fact I don't want the slaughtered remains of animals in my soil. Both these are also considered "hot" which means they can heat up the soil and start thermal composting.

    Greensand
    Takes a few years to be available to the plants. Greensand is also a mineral mix and a long term source of K. Better for breaking up hard clay soil outside.

    Soft Rock Phosphate
    typically a 0-3-0, has been known to be somewhat radioactive.

    Steamed Bone Meal
    there are concerns over 'mad cow disease' and this amendment takes a long time before it becomes available



    Check out my grow! Mars II LED & Organic No-Till Soil.
    http://forum.grasscity.com/organic-grow-journals/1318542-freedom-35.htmlk

    "So for the farmer in his work: serve nature and all is well. Farming used to be sacred work. When humanity fell away from this ideal, modern commercial agriculture rose. When the farmer began to grow crops to make money, he forgot the real principles of agriculture."
     
  11. ^^^^^
     
    I can agree with that list...not necessarily the reasons. So much more could be added to it. Like Espoma products are all dog sh*t. Feather meal ain't cool...but it's cheap and is in everyone of their products concerns over everything from ethoxyquin to arsenic are associated with feather meal.The OMRI label means next to nothing. Literally. It's a scam. Much like the Rev himself.
     
    Before adding every amendment known to man to your soil mix, maybe it would be a good idea to look up actual University studies regarding the potential benefits and/or drawbacks of each and every amendment that you are thinking about using. Maybe like coco coir.
    View attachment coir vs. peat moss.pdf
     
     
     
     
  12. Wow, that's good to know about the OMRI label, Rancho..thank you.

    ..."tapwater is death".. lol, so true!...
     
  13. Hey man...maybe I just have a weird sense of humor. I've been using tapwater for my plants for years without a problem. I was simply trying to illustrate what a moron the Rev is.

    I am no stranger to the Rev or his methods. For two or three years I grew the TLO-Rev style non-sense. I won't say it didn't work. I will say I wasted a shitload of money and never really learned what exactly it was that I was doing.

    Here is a pic of the Skunk Mag that contains the soil mix the OP posted up. Volume 7 Issue 1. Been there. Done that. Never again.

    DSC01389.JPG

    Here's a pic of a really stupid collection of HT and Skunk Mag that I really should just burn out back.

    DSC01388.JPG

    Ed, Kyle, Jorge, The Rev, Subcool, Matt Rize, etc. All these guys are a complete joke. Except it's not so funny.
     
  14. Haha, ok that's cool! I use tap water too, but I let it sit in 5 gallon buckets out in the sun for a day or two first.

    I can smell the chlorine and chloramine in my tap water, and I never liked willingly adding these chemicals to my soils, knowing that it's going to harm all the micro beasties that we put so much effort into raising.

    I also live in a huge metropolitan city tho.. if you can't smell chemicals in yer tapwater and never had an issue then yer probably fine. If it ain't broke don't fix it, right!?!

    Just curious tho, why do you consider the people you named jokes? Not getting defensive, just curious😃...
     
  15. #16 SoloToker, Mar 29, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 29, 2015
    Ask one of them to back their methods up with real science. Most of them made their name in the cannabis industry and are simply raking it in based on stoner science...AKA bullshit. Listen to the Ryan dunn episode on YouTube with the Rev and whichever one is the veganic idiot. The veganic one is the best...he doesnt feed his plants animal products because the lighter diet is easier for them to digest. LMFAO!!! Then listen to the rest of the show with Clackamas Coot and you decide who you'd rather get advice from.

    If you want growing tips look up LumperDawgz, LumperDawgz2, Clackamas Coot, Chunk, BlueJay, GiMik, RanchoDeluxe, and plenty of others here at Grass City. These guys are the real deal using real horticulture knowledge. You won't find them pushing their brands anywhere.

    Solo
     
  16. The rev? [​IMG]
    Coot where are you?
     
  17. Thanks for heads up on that Solo. I've never heard of the Ryan Dunn episode or whatever on YouTube, but I'll definitely be lookin that up tonight!

    I'm very familiar with all the people you named above and more, and respect them all highly!! 😁"chuckle"... But I never thought to look them up on YouTube..

    5sF
     
  18. The rev?

    Coot where are you?

    Right!?!
     
  19. Look for the Ryan Dunn show on living organics...that's the one.
     

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