Collectivism vs Individualism

Individualist. I like being better then someone. Life is a struggle and only through that struggle do the best qualities of mankind come out. When you have nothing but have to fight for it you value it. To me life is a race and so far I am winning it at least in my frame of reference. I will let others sit around the campfire, hold hands and sing songs.
 
It always seems to me the collectivist is usually the one who is needy and wants. They try to appeal to your "compassionate" side or they fall into the category of do as I say not as I do. They want you to help the collective yet they never do themselves. They like the idea of it but not in my backyard mentality.
 
Direct charity or help has 1000x more impact then any government "collectivism" ever does. The "War on poverty" and you can trace day one back to when they launched here in the US has not improved anything. Over 20 trillion spent and its worse by every measurable statistic then it was in the 1960s. Its even  more of a disaster then the "War on Drugs" which is a epic fail in itself.

 

Read Ayn Rand.

 

Why can't we have individualism but work together for mutual benefits?

hey man. ba-a-a-ack off. I can be a sheep all I want!

 

either/or never works on a practical level

 

 
Because in nearly all cases the takers take the makers make. Go read up on the first American Colony. New World, new start. Everyone got a equal share of everything regardless of what they contributed. Descended into famine, cannibalism etc. When they rebooted the colony and tried again you got what you earned. If you had extra you sold it on the market. If you did not contribute you were thrown outside the colony walls to fend for yourself, if you stole you got a bullet in the head. All must earn there keep or you go bye bye.
 
Colony took off big time after that.

 

So you said we can't have individualism with mutualism, then described how we can have it

I'm a lityle.confused. which one is it?

Can't we emphasize individualism while.wworking together for.mutualism?

The answer is capitalism
hey man. ba-a-a-ack off. I can be a sheep all I want!

 

 
Mutualism if its beneficial. To warm the heart forget it. Were all hard wired to be self serving.

 

You misunderstand.

Mutualism is where both parties benefit from working together more so than alone.

Mutualisn IS out of self interest.

Its like, maybe I'm good at building but not good at farming. I can build a farm for someone in exchange for food. We both benefit.

hey man. ba-a-a-ack off. I can be a sheep all I want!

 

It was disease, food shortages, harsh conditions, etc. that caused death and failure at Jamestown, not collectivism directly.   Researchers have found part of one skeleton that scientists suggest belonged to a cannibalized body, after the person had died of other causes.   

 

Collectivist when it comes to survival. So I think a social safety net is necessary.
 
Individualist when it comes psychological perspective. I call it "psychological anarchy".

 

 
When through mismanagement of resources you run out of food. When its the dead of winter up North and your in a camp that has no ability to restock things happen that make you do things you never dreamed....eating a fellow human or dead one happen. Once you start to breach those taboos of society then other things happen.
 
Never trust your fellow man when times get rough. The only person that gives a shit about you is you. If you believe other wise you just never have fully experienced life on survival mode.

 

 
To a degree but I already know when the shit hits the fan anyone not in my group gets a bullet in the head and I take there things. People are worse then the actual event. Katrina is a example of that. The hurricane came and went but those that were stuck descended in a very fast manner into animals. When a human has no repercussions for there actions anything goes.
 
We speak of all of this in our enlightened internet using, not hungry or needy mode. If your talking about survival I assure you when its all over you either become the slayer or you become the cattle. The intellectuals will fall by the wayside and the dude with the biggest stick will win the fight.

 

Well you have two kinds of people: indoor and outoor.
 
Indoor people can't survive without employers, grocery stores and utility companies.
 
Outdoor people can survive if employers, grocery stores and utility companies shut down.
 
I'm an indoor person. I was not raised to be an outdoor person.
 
Sure, it would feel good to say I can survive under any condition but historically there hasn't been a need for that kind of preparation.
 
The Western world has been stable for a very long time. Many generations have gone by only needing indoor skills.
 
So, I feel comfortable being an indoor person. Thankfully we don't live in a wild frontier. We live in a society geared toward indoor people and it's a gift we should all appreciate. Our biggest worry is the pizza man getting our order right, the delivery man getting our video game on time and getting blowjobs while high on the finest sativa.
 
Why constantly train for the end of civilization when it might not come for the next 400 years?

 

I would probably say I am against the philosophy of collectivism, however I would most likely call myself an anarcho-collectivist, except I use the term for an economic model, instead of in a group vs. individual rights way.

 

 
Your type of people were on prime display after Katrina. Day one or two things are ok...you think it will pass. Day 3 your thirsty, your hungry but you can manage with what you got. About day 5-7 is when you find out who you are and what you will do.
 
Why would you constantly train... I don't but I am prepared and that has not been a constant thing just here or there. Funny thing about preppers we are at best wierdos, odd. The guys who tell me I am a fool are literal Nazis about it. Thing is when it does if it does I am a utter genius.
 
If it does happen...sad to say guys like you simply go away. Shot, killed, robbed, whatever. Go investigate the people who did perish after Katrina many of them simply were overwhelmed by what happened and how in a instant there reality changed.
 
In that case individualism triumphed.

 

 
A couple thousand people died from Hurricane Katrina.
 
Louisiana has a population of over 4 million people.
 
That's 4 million people and 99% of the population who didn't need survivalist training.

 

 
Katrina was a localized event that effected people in a particular area. Ask the thousands there if it was worth it.
 
You dont require survivalist training. For what it costs the idiots of the country that blow money at Starbucks every week after a year can net you a fair amount of stuff.
 
Go watch some documentarys on Katrina from Nat Geo to others they show basically the same thing. Roving bands of rapists, looters, killers. Cops killed citizens. Hosptials had to barricade themselves in since the Oxy heads were trying to break in.
 
Collectivism like always failed miserably. In the end were all in it for ourselves.
 
Im not a survivalist but I have guns..lots actually, ammo, first aid kit which cost me 150 bucks for a well equipped one in a nice tactical bag, 150 bucks for a great water filter that is portable, couple months worth of dehydrated food cost me about 300. My bug out plan revolves around my ruck sack. Everything I need for quite some time can be stuffed into that thing.

 

"Your type of people"?

"Guys like you"?

Tell me more about your brand of "individualism". Does it only apply to people with big guns and survivalist training who are only out for themselves? And everyone else is just... "one of those people"?

 

So stealing someone moeny to save someone else is OK?

hey man. ba-a-a-ack off. I can be a sheep all I want!