Is Islam That Bad Of A Religion?

Discussion in 'Religion, Beliefs and Spirituality' started by ErdayToker, Jun 13, 2014.

  1. I grew up with Catholic parents, I'm very pressured to stay Catholic. I've told my parents this, I do believe in God and a lot of the Bible but some of it I can not believe / agree with. Sometimes I think organized religion is just way for people to make some money and another way for people to feel better than others (I go to church more than you so I am a better person mindset). My mother is also for women's rights 100%. 
     
    Is Islam as bad as the news and my parents say it is? Do they really treat women terribly? (Ex. if the girl gets raped it's her fault and is put to death?) Is Islam a religion of hate? Are extreme Muslims the reason for terrorism or is that a different thing?
     
    It annoys me because I think Palestine and Israel should both be recognized countries. My parents on the other hand, think Palestine and Muslims should have no say or land in the area. 
     
    Thanks.

     
  2. No. Islam is not a bad religion. Just as every other religion, you'll have your bad apples. I have many Muslim friends and they're all respectful. They also tend to practice their religion fully unlike some Christians I know. If you want my opinion, find a mosque in your area, go to it and talk with the Imam (He's like the preacher basically). Ask him some questions that you'd like to know about Islam and be truthful as well as respectful with him. The bigotry that surrounds this religion is sad because they are people with beliefs just like you and I.

    After all, their religion comes from the same part of the world as your's so in a way, you're spiritual cousins.
     
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  3. My mum is Christian and my dad is Muslim. I don't practice either but I have a decent knowledge of both sides and I believe in God. Islam is not a hateful religion, in fact it's very peaceful. The problem isn't with the religion, it's with the people who claim to follow that religion. Because they use their distorted views and make everyone think that all the followers of that religion share the same views. That's not the case. The majority of Muslims are kind, caring, friendly people who are upstanding members of their communities. It's just a select few people that give the religion a bad name. The reality is every religion has it's good followers and it's fair share of nutters.

    Also the media has a massive part to play. They decide what the people see and they tell people what to fear.

    My advice would be to do ur research mate. You'll learn a lot from the internet. Just ask the right questions. Good luck ;)


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  4. Go to reddit and checkout /r/islam. They're pretty cool over there. I'd say it's the next best thing (besides internet research) to meeting with an Imam.
     
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  5. Its the same theological basis of any other monotheistic religion.However, theirs is one a little more prone to excessive hate in the current times. Christians hate them because they are praising allah, their creator god, and they (the more extremist types) think of all non muslims as infidels. Why can't the Christian creator god and allah be the same being?Differing religions, duhInteresting factiod though: While in control of Afghanistan, the Taliban eradicated opium production. >Inform yourself
     
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  6. All religions are bad

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  7. #7 Brother Urb, Jun 14, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 14, 2014
    I have known many Muslim in my lifetime. They are not bad people. No they do not all treat women terribly.  Only select crazy fuck.  That's like saying all Christians/Catholics are like the KKK because the KKK happens to practice that religion(or whatever religion they practice, I don't fuckin know which one.  KNowmsayin?). If you study their religion or speak with them/learn you will realize they are not very different from Christians or Catholics. There are bad people of every race and religion.  There are also extremists in every religion.
     
    Your parents are fucked and I wouldn't be surprised if they are racist/classist/sexist.
     
    I'm not religious but I don't judge people for being religious.  If it brings them happiness and joy and they do not force it or harm others than I'm fine with it.
     
    jews, muslims, christians/ what the fucks the difference?/
    we all want money drugs and bitches/
    anybody that doesn't rubs me suspicious/
     
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  8. The only bad Muslims are the ones that act bad. Just as in any other culture.

    Although it would be nice if Muslims and Israelites would finally get along. Personally I think their hate of each other will start ww3.
     
  9. #9 Wakeboard, Jun 15, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 15, 2014
    I'm going to play devil's advocate, just because I can.
     
    Obviously what everyone has said is true, that there are terribly ignorant people who practice every religion. However, I think the 'fringe' beliefs of Islam are becoming increasingly more popular. The portion of Islamic societies who practice Islamism (radical Islam) and believe in extreme interpretations of Sharia law is growing. Look up the 'Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant' and you will get an idea of what these advocates believe. Whilst a small minority, they are not so insignificant that their beliefs should be simply dismissed as 'radical' because there are people who full heartedly believe it, and are prepared to give their lives for it.
     
    One word that I would not use to describe Islam is peaceful. In many countries where Islam is the dominant religion, the punishment for Apostasy is the death penalty. To me that is hateful.
     
    I also loathe the concept of head scarves. Having spoken to Muslim girls who wear headscarves and asked their opinion of it, they don't agree with me. I see it as a misogynist subordination of women. They see it as them fulfilling their duty and respect to their God. Which, I don't disagree with. However, the simple fact that most Muslim women who wear the head scarf do not start doing so until they hit puberty, is a clear indication that there is some sexual basis for its widespread use. They say they are not repressed, I say they are misguided. 
     
    That all said - Muslims who grew up in Western societies are not a very accurate sample of the broader population. Obviously, growing up in a Western society makes you privy to our culture and politics. Resulting in Muslims in North America, Europe and Australia/NZ having different views from those who grow up in the Middle East. I do truly believe that Western values and Islam are not fully reconcilable, not without one group making compromise for the beliefs of the other.

    That all said, people are just people - neither good nor bad. We believe what our experiences lead us to believe, and you cannot fault another human being for not sharing your exact experience. Which, is why I do not believe in Christianity - because it presumes that only people who live according to the teachings of Jesus Christ will be saved. This is fundamentally flawed, because billions of people have lived and died who would not have been able to access these teachings. For instance, a person born on the Pacific Island of Nauru in the year 1272 - how on earth would they have any chance of being 'saved'? Many people believe in religion because it gives them a sense of justice in an otherwise anarchical and unfair world. However, where is the sense of justice in a situation like the one I just described?
     
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  10. Islam isn't a bad religion at all, it's like any other religion really when you look at it. You go by a set a beliefs and praise or worship a god/allah. I am technically catholic but I don't focus on religion anymore, last time i went to church was when i was 13. But I feel that the islam religion has gotten alot of controversy because of terrorists going by it, even though thats not what the religion is about and that the media created a retarded stereotype
     
  11. So much wrong in this post. Islam is not the only religion where women cover their head. It is not Islam you are talking about, but rather some cultures in the Middle East. The notion that religion is bad is so wrong. Religion itself does nothing good or bad, but individual people who do. You cannot blame a religion for what a person does.

    "One word that I would not use to describe Islam is peaceful. In many countries where Islam is the dominant religion, the punishment for Apostasy is the death penalty. To me that is hateful." This is what happens when you mix politics with religion and this is why we advocate for a separation between church and state.
     
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  12. "O ye who believe! Do not squander one another's wealth in vanities, but let there be amongst you traffic and trade by mutual good will." 

    The Prophet Muhammad (s) said: “Do not turn away a poor man…even if all you can give is half a date. If you love the poor and bring them near you…God will bring you near Him on the Day of Resurrection.” - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 1376.

    The Prophet Muhammad (s) said: ““It is better for a leader to make a mistake in forgiving than to make a mistake in punishing.” - Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 1011.

    “The most perfect in faith amongst believers is he who is best in manners and kindest to his wife.” - Muhammad (p) cited in Sunnan Abu Dawud.

    The Prophet Muhammad (s) said: “Anybody who believes in Allah and the Last Day should not harm his neighbor, and anybody who believes in Allah and the Last Day should entertain his guest generously, and anybody who believes in Allah and the Last Day should talk what is good or keep quiet (i.e. abstain from all kinds of evil and dirty talk).“ -  Narrated by Abu Hurayrah, Sahih Al Bukhari, Vol: 8 Hadith 47.

    “Do not be people without minds of your own, saying that if others treat you well you will treat them well and that if they do wrong you will do wrong. But (instead) accustom yourselves to do good if people do good and not to do wrong if they do evil.” - Prophet Muhammad (s) as reported in Al-Tirmidhi, Hadith 1325.

    “An adulterer will not commit adultery when he has full faith (in Allah), and a thief will not steal when he has full faith (in Allah)..” - Ibn Majah.

    “The (true) servants of (God) the Most Gracious are those who walk on the earth in humility, and when the ignorant address them, reply with (words of) peace.” - The Holy Quran, 25:63.

    "The seeking of knowledge is obligatory for every Muslim." Prophet Muhammad (s) as reported by Ibn Majah and Bayhaqi in Shu'ab al-Iman; also reported by Anas Ibn Malik in Al Tirmidhi, hadith #74.

    “The worst of guardians is a cruel ruler. Beware of becoming one of them.” - Prophet Muhammad (s) as reported in Sahih Muslim, Hadith 846.

    The Prophet Muhammad (s) said: “Allah will not be merciful to those who are not merciful to people.” - Sahih al-Bukhari, Vol. 9, #473.

    "They are the losers, those who make the religion hard and tough. They imperil themselves who enforce tough practices of Islam. They destroy themselves, those who are extremes." - Prophet Muhammad (s) as reported by Ibn Masud in Sahih Muslim.

    “Anyone who has property that exceed his needs, let him support someone whose property does not (meet his or her needs), and anyone whose food exceeds his needs, let him share it with someone who does not have food.“ - Prophet Muhammad (s) in Fiqh-us-Sunnah, Volume 3, Number 93C.

    "Yesterday I was clever, so I wanted to change the world. Today I am wise, so I am changing myself." -  Rumi.
     
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  13. All religions are "that bad". They widen the cultural, spiritual, and mental divide between members of our species in a way that is marginally detrimental. Aspects of every religion exhibit oppressive, sexist, racist, and/or homophobic tendencies. All have played central roles in massacres and wars that could fill valleys with blood. Religions are kept out of convenience, because they sure as shit aren't kept out of benevolence.
     
  14. Take note, that anyone who speaks ill of the Quran hasn't read the Quran.
     
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  15. No Islam is not a bad religion. It is from the same tradition as ours (I'm Catholic as well) and Judaism. A good book is World Religions and the Norms of War. It explains how the major religions define jus ad bellum and jus in bello. Also the Catholic Church during the Middle Ages is very interesting history.

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  16.  
    Here's the problem with cherry picking quotes from any religious text - you can basically prove any point under the sun. Especially when taking them out of context. Hence why most organized religions have separate sects, the interpretation changes based upon who is reading. For example, Leviticus 18:22 of the old testament is often cited as the basis for anti-homosexual belief. Yet, some sects of Judaism do not oppose homosexual intercourse (E.g. Reform Judaism) yet Orthodox Judaism certainly does. However, the bible clearly states (I'm not trying to advocate the position, it's just helpful to prove my point) that it is an abomination to lie with a man as one lies with a woman. So religion is the practice of interpreting religious texts, not the texts themselves.
     
    Therefore, it is imperative to delineate the texts of a religion from the religion itself. The Qur'an is not Islam. It may seem like a semantic difference, but it is actually the key to my argument entirely. As I continually said, most Muslims do not have a radical interpretation of the Qur'an. However, a not insignificant portion of muslims do; enter Islamism. I would define Islamism as a sect of Islam, whether you agree with that definition or not. 
     
     

    There is really not anything wrong in it. Unless you meant wrong in the context of morals. In which case, I do not agree. However, that's your opinion to have. That said, empirically everything I said was factual.
     
     


    I never said Islam was the only religion in which women cover their head. Don't make a straw man's argument by countering claims I never made. I do not support any religion that forces its adherents to conform to a specific code of dress. However, the Niqab and Burkha are certainly at the extreme end of it, and his question was about Islam, so I addressed the issue of head scarves in the context of the question at hand.
     


    Religion is part of culture. One cannot speak of one without the other. You cannot in anyway think of these concepts as being mutually exclusive. They are perpetually intertwined. 

     


    You're absolutely right, religion itself is benign, therefore one cannot characterise it with terms such as 'good' or 'bad'. I never explicitly said 'Islam is bad' because I don't believe that to be true. As I said above, it all comes down to the interpretation. From the vantage point of Western society and its ethics, the interpretation of Islam that has lead to its radicalization is indeed bad. However, these terms are entirely subjective.

     

    Yes, the punishment for Apostasy in Islam is death, and this sadly is not a radical interpretation. I fully agree with you that secularism is desirable. However, Islamism is exactly the opposite of secularity. You're helping to prove my point, because the adherents to this interpretation (that word again) want to mix politics with religion as much as possible.
     
    Essentially all I'm saying is that Islam at present (I will not make this claim for all of history), is increasingly more apt to extreme interpretations than are other religions, generally speaking. Many of these interpretations (Islamism) are indeed hateful, and these radical interpretations do have a significant number of adherents. Also, any religion that advocates the death penalty as a punishment for apostasy should not be described as peaceful, in any context.
     
  17. When you remove culture and politics from the religion, it is not as evil as you may hear. You hear about all of the violence in the book but you must take into account world affairs in those times. Islamism and advocates of extreme versions of sharia law, once again, I do not advocate for religious law anywhere, not even Buddhist-based religious law even though I agree with many points in the philosophy. It should also be taken into account how many practitioners of Islam there are in the world who follow their religion in a moderate way, healthy way that doesn't go preaching to others. We hear about all of the bad, but we never look at the good. Just because we have nutjobs like Westboro doesn't mean we should judge the rest of those who practice that religion who are not hateful with it. I see what you're saying, but I think you're missing my point. I know all of the bad things associated with this religion, but you must see it differently. We are trying our hardest to expose any and all negative things regarding this religion because it supports the agenda of hating the enemy. And when you basically make war with an entire people, you cause even more people to hate you.

    Also, I wasn't cherry picking. I was merely showing the positive side of Islam that people often overlook. We all know we can find horrible things in the bible, but we shouldn't judge it by those standards alone. The Qur'an and the Bible have a great source of wisdom that goes overlooked more often than not. I think of a lot of these texts have been taken out of context as you said above, but I also think people take things as fact that aren't supposed to be taken literally.

    Even in Buddhism, a religion widely regarded as one of the most peaceful religions, has different sects that often dispute over different interpretations and such. Many Buddhists worship the Buddha even when he said he did not seek worship nor did he claim to be a god like people often depict him as. This causes problems in Buddhism as well.

    Also take into account, American politics sponsored radical Islam to fight the soviets and anything else to support an agenda.
     
  18. I'm a Muslim.
     
    No, it's not a bad religion at all. I was always taught to do good in the world and the world will do good for me.
     
    Women wearing headscarves is a choice they make willingly. There are many reason why one would wear one. To say it is a misguidance is somewhat ignorant in my opinion. Most women do it to be modest in appearance to ward off the wrong kind of attention.
     
    Allah is just an Arabic translation for the word God. In Islam, Allah actually has 99 names. Christian God and Islamic Allah = same thing. God.
     
    Like others have said, you got your bad apples in every tree. Of course everyone hates the Muslims right now. Thank you media. You never hear about the good Muslims. When you hear the opposite what do you expect the public to think?
     
    The statement about "Westernized Muslims" is somewhat unfair I think. You will never meet a perfect Muslim. Just like you will never meet a perfect Christian. 
     
    The Quran is something that took me years to even begin to understand. I had to read it in Arabic as a kid and had no clue what I was reading. Not until I became an adult did I read the English translation.
     
    Reading it always brings peace and calm over me. But one thing I know for sure is that some parts of the Quran is very vague in some of it's messages. 
     
    It is easy to take a certain text and take it out of context. Just like the the radicals do. They read one thing on Jihad and think Allah wants them to strap bombs and go kill yourself. It is a major sin to take the life Allah has blessed you with.
     
    I'm not perfect. I smoke weed, I do other dumb shit from time to time. But I try to follow the 5 pillars of Islam as best as I can with the life I have been given.
     
    /rambling
     
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  19. You cant compare the islam you learned in america/the west to actual islam that is taught in the middle east. We westerners just took the islam religion and turned it into our own version, I believe the westernized muslims actually are peaceful because thats what is actually taught to them. The real unchanged islam is the one you see in the middle east with people blowing people up in the name of jihad and stoning a woman who is raped by 3 men just because its apparently her fault according to the sharia law.

    The same goes for christianity. Most "christians" in america are simply taught the changed and edited version of Christianity, the kind that blasphemous and idiotic rick warren teaches. The west is known to take the general ideas of a religion and turn it into what they want it to mean.

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  20. Uhhh, no? So real Islam = bad while American Islam = good? What the fuck?
     
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