Yay For Evolution..

Discussion in 'Science and Nature' started by Mantikore, May 21, 2014.

  1.  
    I would still be skeptical of the claim as they failed to mention blood types of those in the study, which is a very important factor. Mosquitoes have preference to blood types, and I have no doubt that different physical traits can produce different pheromones. They have been shown to prefer O type people, which is what I am. If they took the scent from someone with a blood type that isn't preferred and put it on one arm of an O type person, there's no doubt they'd go after the arm without the scent. I don't see it as repelling, just that it's not their preference and they're going to go towards their preference. The whole stress/diseased thing doesn't click for me either cause I have Lyme disease which brings about a ton of physical stress (with the gray hairs that come with it) and they still love eating me alive.
     
    Plus, this was published in 09 and they said they hope to have a commercial product to market in a year or 2.. and I haven't seen any bug repellants that rely on naturally created human repellants. I would of bought it to try it out if there was.
     
     
    Consider yourself lucky.. I'd say in my 29 years, I've had at least 100 ticks sink their jaws into me and that's low-balling it. I was the kind of kid who'd come home from school and pretty much go straight to exploring in the woods, come in to eat dinner, and go back out til it was time to sleep. Some days I was covered in ticks, ended up getting the nickname 'tick boy' from my ex stepmother.

     
  2. I've heard that O type is more attractive to insects. But, I have O+ blood type and I'm usually the least bitten on camping trips. I never use but repellant but still rarely get bitten. Makes me think that there must be a bit more to it.

    As for the researchers coming out with a product, they say in the article that the problem lay in keeping the chemical from evaporating upon being sprayed. Although without any real results their research doesn't matter I suppose.
     
  3.  
    The panties were just for fun.
     
  4. Just smoke more weed, I'm sure the THC or the smoke will keep them away lol
     
    Seriously though....it seems when I go out camping my friends DEET up while I never do and they are always getting swarmed by Skeeters while only a few bother me
     
  5.  
    I'm not arguing just to argue, but reason being is I've been doing my fair share of (amateur) research and experimenting. I'm not against synthetics, but I am a firm believer that if something is a product of nature, there's another product of nature that can counteract it.. just a matter of finding the needle in the haystack. So it's a possibility that a human could naturally produce something that actually repels, but I highly doubt it. There really isn't any cases that I know of or could find of an animal producing a chemical repellant. It would be a wasted effort evolutionary speaking, because insects are incredibly fast evolvers compared to animals. A horse's tail serves 2 purposes, to swat away flies and emotional cues. If they ever evolved a chemical repellant, it really wouldn't be that long until the insects that target them evolve a way around it, or even worse, use it as a marker. I am pretty convinced that these mosquitoes (Mosquito Aedes) have adapted, at least some, to citronella since it's commercialization. Every single time I've used it, it was like chumming the water for sharks.. worse than when I went with nothing. It took awhile to convince me, so I tried it several times and learned to not use it during mosquito season. Synthetic repellants can work wonders, but I don't doubt that if their recipes don't change often, insects will evolve to counteract it. Bacteria are quick evolvers too, that's how MRSA came about. Once antibiotics were mass produced and wide spread, they'd evolve to get passed it. Then we'd switch it up and they evolved again. Say we created a chemical that specifically targeted mosquitoes and was proven to have no effect whatsoever and covered the world with it all at the same moment, I'd say there is a 99.9999999% chance that a few mosquitoes exist where the chemical would have no effect. The survivors would then have a free for all. It's evolution, it's a never ending battle.. and since insects are superior to animals in how fast they evolve, animals get stuck with physical means, not chemical. On a side note, that's why I am not really worried about the bees. Even if man made chemicals are adding to their disappearance, there's more than likely one individual who is already unaffected by said chemical.. just "waiting" for the rest to die off so it can have it's population boom.
     
    But yeah, it's more than likely that they just don't like you.. and that is something worth looking into in itself just for knowing. If humans could produce a natural repellant, I probably would of been experimenting with it. I've done the garlic thing, and while I love garlic, you pretty much have to enough it to the point where you start to smell it in your piss.. It'd be cool if there was something we produced that could repel them, but even if we figured it out, making it widespread will just force them to evolve to combat it. Then it would need tweaked and they'd evolve again. If we did find something and insisted on commercializing it, I'd put it in a creme if a spray isn't working. There's a few different bonding agents that could probably hold it in. Hell, human pheromones get infused in products like deodorants and soaps as it is. I would just take solace in knowledge that they're avoiding you cause you don't have what they prefer. Maybe they prefer something that only O type people can produce, but maybe a few O type people don't produce it? I don't know, but I am pretty sure we (or most animals from fish and amphibians on up) don't naturally produce insect repellant. Plants can cause they evolve quickly too, that's why we use them to repel.
     
  6.  
    The thing is, I don't think the rapid evolution of bacteria is even closely paralleled by mosquitoes. Secondly, the resistance that bacteria have built is usually a specific protein that has mutated which disrupts the fairly specific mode of action that drugs necessarily have. On the other hand, repellants and insecticides are arguably more non-specific in their action, and I would postulate that building resistance to them would be much harder (eg. evolving an entirely new olfactory receptor, which is unlikely). Furthermore, if it was used on an 'as-needed' basis as you would kind of assume it woul be, then humans could protect themselves from mosquitoes who may then find their feed on livestock or otherwise.. hopefully further reducing any chance of widespread resistance.
     
  7. I agree that they're not as fast as bacteria, but they're not far up the line. In terms of speed ranking, it'd probably go something like bacteria, plants and insects (the 2 of them are the majority of chemical warfare), fish and amphibians, reptiles and birds, then mammals starting with rodents. Life that relies on mass numbers in reproduction typically adapts and evolves quicker. They have thousands of offspring each one with mutations. With the kind of variety and adaptability, it doesn't take them long. Repellants typical offend one or more of the insects senses, but that doesn't mean it'll work on them all. There's a good chance that there's at least one out there with a mutation that changes how offended they are, if at all. While it might not be as varied as humans, its similar to us with having variety. Some people hate certain smells while others love them, tolerances vary. That's why it would be best on an as needed basis, but if one thing is for sure, there's many of us out there without care for control. The best way is only using it when needed and a variety. Plus, we've been using natural repellants for ages now.. so the ball could of been rolling for awhile only to get a push with the age of commercialization.

    Insecticides are a lil different. My hypothetical insecticide is more specific, while pretty much all of them are broad as you said. It'd be a chemical that targets only mosquitoes and is completely inert to everything and anything else, even microbes. That's pretty much an impossible scenario, but if it were doable it'd have to target the mosquito specifically. With the billions and billions out there, there's a high probability that one of them is already different in that what we targeted on them has a mutation and renders it ineffective on the individual. Said individuals would then pretty much have the house all to themselves and go wild.. making babies that are resistive as well.

    With our bees though, I believe that even with a broad attack, that there are ones out there that are less effected, if at all. I've used insecticides before where there was one or two that just didn't want to die or took way longer than the others. While I don't believe the tin foil conspiracy about the farmer breeding bees that are resistant to Monsanto's Roundup and they had the government come in and destroy his bees, but I do believe he was working on it or at least trying. With as fragile as nature is, it's pretty damn tough at the same time. I have "faith" that our bees will make it out in the end.. even better if we stabilize the recipe and keep it that way so they can play catch up.

    Maybe that's just me though cause while I don't like most of the damage we do, I believe that everything will work out. It sucks always looking at it grimly, like with the plastics everywhere. Give it time and all that plastic will just open up a niche for microbes to eat and break down once they evolve into it.
     
  8. that's good to know

    Sent from my LG-E739 using Grasscity Forum mobile app
     
  9. you're welcome
     
  10. While I hate the way it feels on my skin, I've had some success with DEET. They are really bad right now, like really fucking bad. If I am walking the trail at work, if I stop a swarm catches up to me. They swarm the dogs too.. I sprayed myself the other day, everywhere but my face.. and I got a bunch of bits on my face. Even with the DEET, I still get some here and there. I try to kill those bastards ASAP though cause if they resist DEET and I let them live, that just means I'll have to deal with most of their babies resisting DEET.
     
  11. #31 Nerd139, Sep 29, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 29, 2014
    Do a scientific study. Get a few people and test how attracted mosquitos are to them before and after application of the oil.

    Does one species seem more attracted than another? Does applying the oil in other ways ptoduce different effects? How long after application do the mosquitos wait to bite?
     
  12. #32 smokehound, Oct 1, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 1, 2014
    Mosquitoes arent attracted to pheromones, they follow your carbon dioxide trail, like every other fly/insect that feeds on mammalian blood.

     The only true effective repellant is DEET.  citronella is not a good repellant, and is known to attract insects, due to its aroma.

     You think your mosquitoes are bad?  look at this monster:

    [​IMG]
     
      this is a gallinipper, a large mosquito with a thick proboscis, and doesnt rely on stealth.  Bites from these just plain smart!

     and let's not forget these monsters:

     [​IMG]
     
     Western horsefly..  a few days ago, I was in the desert with my friend, and the poor guy was being mercilessly attacked, they have a very terrifying habit of circling you quickly, looking for the best spot to slice you open; their mouthparts are like a speculum with blades on it.

      Their bites HURT.  They secrete an anticoagulant that can cause severe wounds, should they bite you in the wrong place.

     Here's what they can do to you:

    [​IMG]

     
     
  13. Completely unrelated but if you think about it birds are just big mosquitoes that don't suck blood.
     
    If you put a few rubbersnakes on your lawn and roof etc, the birds won't come. They're not stupid though, so you have to keep moving the snakes around.
     
  14. Lol that'll attract birds if you live in raptor country.  birds of prey love eating snakes.  they even know how to take down vipers.
     
  15. #35 Nerd139, Oct 2, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 2, 2014
    There are some blood eating birds. They peck at open wounds or in the case of the kea actively hunt sheeps for blood meals.

    Also, you think I want to climb on my goddamn roof everyday or every other day to move some toy snakes around? I think a better solution is needed if bird nests are such a huge problem for some. Either it wont be done regularly enough, ill fall off the ladder, or ill forget what the snakes look like get bit by a real one and fall off the ladder.
     
  16.  
    No matter what, you'll end up falling off the latter.
     
    Best stay away from it then.
     
  17. Love it. The latter was the ladder. +Rep
     
  18. Good call. Now imagine this horrid scenario: I go out between dusk and dawn wearing cintronella oil thinking it will protect me from mosquitos. I bring the ladder so I can change the arrangement of the snakes on the roof. As I get to the top of the ladder I get swarmed by more mosquitos imaginable, get bit by a real snake and fall off the ladder, and the hordes of birds swoop in to peck at my bledding head wound.

    Imagine what could have happened if I didnt read this thread lol.
     
  19.  
    I think I just saved your life.
     
  20. Please you must allow me to repay you for saving me.

    I shall allow you to suck my dick. Not because you are a girl but because I cant think of a greater honor, haha.
     

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