Best Pure Indica Strains for X with Durban Poison to Make Fun F1s?

Discussion in 'Cannabis Breeding' started by Afghancamel, Nov 1, 2013.

  1. #1 Afghancamel, Nov 1, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 1, 2013
    I need advice on the selection of 3 or 4 strains of 100% pure/IBL/breeding standard Indica to cross with Durban Poison to create potent, low odor (when growing), fun to use F1s that will give my preferred style of medicine of Indica dominant/pure Indica genetics a "lift" and be consistent quality-wise. The shorter the flowering time of the mother strains the better, but it isn't a critical factor.
     
    I can arrange my garden to deal with different phenotypes, and I can choose what buds to smoke for effect, but I want consistency when it comes to potency from these F1s. 
     
    After 3 1/2 years of growing out mongrel F1s that resulted from a breeding program that failed due to ignorance (mine), and more lately some hand picked F2s (some amazing individuals among them, but everything is hermie), I'm sick of the hit-and-miss nature of my grows.The good plants can be extremely good, but the poor ones are truly poor. I only grow enough to be self-sufficient, so if some of it isn't up to scratch I'm stuck with using it anyway. I have decided to give up on them entirely.
     
    It takes the same amount of love, care and dollars to grow any 10 plants out, I want to make it count on a more consistent basis.
     
    Although I want consistency of potency and effect for medicinal purposes, I also like to have fun during the grow and it's always good to have at least one jar that is special  :D 
     
    I have some newly acquired Sensi Northern Lights #1,2+5, Sagamartha NL#9 and BC Seed Company NL#5 beans, all regular,  that will be going into my next proper grow. I intend to produce seeds from the best individuals. I know from personal experience that you can easily get 5+ years out of well stored beans (the enemies are moisture and dryness).
     
    Each Northern Lights strain will be maintained. I'm not intending to start crossing them with each other. I want 3 consistent strains that meet my medical needs. After the first grow of the next generation, I will know how to maximize my grow when using all three strains at once.
     
    Now that my medicinal needs are taken care of, I'm beginning to think about how to go about creating some fun and interesting, but overall reliable, F1 Indica/Sativa hybrids. I will try to grow out, say, two females per grow for social use, small gifts to friends who have different tastes, and well, like I said, just for fun and interest.
     
    Odor is critical for me. Or should I say, lack thereof. I cannot be stinking out the whole apartment block with skunk. I have a carbon scrubber that is very effective. It's also pretty loud. So I am somewhat limited with when I can use it. Beside the fact that Northern Lights is exactly what I was after for medicine, it is notoriously low odor during the grow. It's how I found the strain during my research.
     
    Odor won't be a concern when I'm only growing a few F1s at a time in among my low-odor NL's, but I'll have to dedicate a whole grow to the F1 hybrid seed creation project at one stage or another (I think). I can't have 24 stinkers vegging out in order to ensure I get at least 10 females that will stink out a city block. Please restrict suggested Indicas to those that aren't too bad, odor-wise.
     
    So, I'm going to use a Dutch Passion Durban Poison male as the daddy for my F1s. My research tells me that the beans are from a potent, low odor, never-hybridized, 100% pure IBl Sativa with a number of other recommendable features, and I'm hoping to cross him into 3 or 4, maybe more, female IBL/Pure indicas that I am yet to select.
     
    I hope this isn't a breach of protocol?  :unsure: I had decided on Durban Poison for my Sativa, the grow report at the link below convinced me on the seedbank;
     
    http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/4400.html
     
    One lesson I learnt from my earlier, spectacularly failed, experiment was that the Sensi Hindu Kush is a great breeding strain. The F1s that I've grown out over the past few years have been notably consistent in size (big buds) and better than average potency/quality of stone. Generally, the only differences among them (and sometimes it is quite pronounced) is in leaf/flower color and in finishing times.
     
    So, Sensi Hindu Kush is on my list.
     
    I have a number of others in mind, but I'd like to hear a few suggestions before I put them out there. Some people get a set on a strain unfairly, just because they didn't grow it out properly.
     
    Please, suggest only Breeding-grade (landrace, IBL, ultra-stabilized hybrids etc), 100% Indica strains. By using them with an IBL Sativa, I'm hoping to keep my F1 consistency levels high.
     
    Any suggestions, statements of fact, accounts of similar breeding and/or grows gratefully appreciated   :)

     
  2. U had me at Durban and sensi's Northern lights. Those r both on my list. Sensi's hindu kush is already n my collection. Iv grown out a pak already but only had a successful male. My fault. But hav two more pacs to go thru. DNA genetics has a pure Afghan that they do not breed themselvs, rather get them from an original maintainer in Afghanistan. I think ur choices r pretty dead on. Tho u will eventually go beyond the F1's. Clones can easily replace seedlings, once selections r made.

    Sent from my DROID X2 using Grasscity Forum mobile app

     
  3. #3 Afghancamel, Nov 3, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 3, 2013
     
    Thanks,
     
    I want to keep my NL's "pure" within the strains as they are.
     
    I have been growing in doors for 20 years with the most basic of systems and methods and I'm only now researching more sophisticated techniques. I have only just come across the concept of using CFL lighting for cannabis, but I know nothing about it. I want to incorporated it into my grow space to enhance lighting at the lower branches, but only if it is worth my while.
     
    The interesting thing about CFL's is I just may be able to have a few mother plants for clones after-all. That would be great if I came across a freak F1. I will investigate CFL's in depth, but in the meantime, I am concentrating on the purest strains possible to cross with the DP to avoid "complications" with my F1s.
     
    I know it's a bit of an oxymoron, but I am looking to breed F1s that are consistent with regards to potency/effects. I'm not after 25% THC, 8% will do fine, it just has to have a bit of a kick and be different to my indica pain relievers.
     
    I have seen the DNA Genetics Afghan you mention, and it is one of the ones I am thinking about, so it's good to get an un-prompted endorsement for that strain. 
     
    Still, I have to avoid acting like a child in a candy store and start buying everything that looks interesting. The strains MUST have a good reputation for potency and consistency.
     
    I want to keep it to 4 Indica strains maximum, 2 strains minimum. With Hindu Kush already selected, I only need one more certainty. Still, three would be great and I'll go with four it it gets to the point where I just can't justify leaving one out.
     
    Thanks again for the reply. Feel free to add further advice. Let us know how your NL's, DPs and whatever other strains you choose go. We can trade do's every now and then, and don'ts every other day   :)
     
  4. #4 Afghancamel, Nov 3, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 3, 2013
    Further to the questions posed in the thread:
     
    Should I consider crossing males from my selected Indica strains into a female Durban Poison instead of the other way around, as I am intending?
     
    What would be the advantages and/or disadvantages? 
     
    I will be growing the parents of my F1s in the same grow, and I will be growing out males from every strain to cross with the best of its sisters so that, like my Northern Lights varieties, I can keep the family line going without adulteration. And it allows me to create more F1s in later years.
     
  5. It sounds like ur headed in the direction id go. T5's r excellent for veg and side lighting. Iv even flowered w a 4' 6 lamp w good results. It culd put out a qp at a time. I think uv got more than most as far as a breeding plan. Doesnt sound like accidental breedind. Solid genetics, ur were id like to b w my strains. Iv got breeding plans, bout 5-7 n mind.

    Sent from my DROID X2 using Grasscity Forum mobile app

     
  6. I dont know, But i have a Indica that i will be crossing in to a few here real soon
     
  7.  
    Thanks for the contribution.
     
    Yeah, my first effort was totally random. I could have starting choosing some individuals from the F1s and F2s arising from the mess I made the first time around, but I might have spent ten years getting to where I'll be in 12 months from now as a result of starting from scratch  :D
     
  8. #8 Afghancamel, Nov 15, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 15, 2013
     
    To a few...? Durban Poisons? Sativas?
     
    Whatever, let me know how it goes.
     
    I'm interested in any deliberative breeding of F1s using a Sativa IBL crossed with an indica IBL, or super-stable strains of each   :)
     
  9. #9 bioguy, Dec 27, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 27, 2013
    I heard that you you the female for high and male for structure long ago. I just read thats wrong and the cross can go either way and makes no difference (that was in the overgrow archive on the first page somewhere so I suspect its correct). 
     
    For a strain look into Tom Hill's Deep Chunk. I have never grown it but I have seen it recommended as a good true breeding Indica several times. It says it in the strain description so this may just be people regurgitating it. May also be true. 
     
    I have also liked everything I grew from Mandala (they don'y like my system but the products great and others I know can grow it), I think they have some Indica's that are unrelated to most of the stuff on the market. 
     
    Ace has a great reputation, you might try their Yunnan that is unrelated to virtually all of the stuff on the market. I read their PCK is a lack luster breeder.  
     
    I would also no be afraid of the Indica heavy crosses that are not IBL. The more stable the strain you choose is, the more uniform the F1 will be... but If your just looking for a cut (having fun) then the multi phenotype effect of hybrid might get you something really different. 
     
    On that note, I would love to see what wild aromas might arise from a (Chem or Diesel) x Indica hybrid. 
     
    Finally, If its a bomb Durban you might also try and preserve it. Lots of people looking for good Durban and nobody real happy with any of the seeds available. The Durban x Skunk looks like the closest thing to Durban worth buying these days (seeds). Colorado has an elusive cut I've been stalking (unsuccessfully) for a few years.  IT AMAZING!
     
    Happy Hunting 
     
  10. #10 Afghancamel, Jan 16, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 16, 2014
     
    I can start my grow with as many as 30 seedlings. I have 4 feminized Dutch Passion Blueberry beans and 2 feminized Blue Dream beans that will give me something and I have a packet of 10 regular beans for each of Sensi Northern Lights, British Columbia NL #5 and DJ Shorts Blueberry that I'll be planting within weeks (when I finally get my new grow room happening, I'm a month behind schedule :( ).
     
    I'll be growing them out with a view to finding some keepers. Ideally I want a DJ Short Blueberry mother and an NL mother of no particular brand. These will be my stock genetics and I can then play around with some F1s as already described.
     
    Anyway, I will retain the best female regardless, it will keep me ticking over while I keep looking for those keepers...
     
    (I expect that people will suggest crossing the Durban Poison into any top grade Blueberry or NL keeper I find, and I'm sure to do so, but I'd like to see where I can get using landrace/IBL's on both sides of the cross). 
     
    Once I have some clones from the first grow above happening I will grow out packets of 10 regular beans each of Sagarmatha NL #9 and KC Brains Northern Light Special that I have on hand just to see what I can find there.
     
    (Then again, for emergency purposes I'll be farming some beans from these strains using the best male and female I find from each strain - should I grow out and trawl through these pure-strain F1s looking for keepers, perhaps, rather than spending big dollars on yet more packets of beans?)
     
    At this stage for my fun breeding program I have World of Seeds Afghan Kush, WOS's Pakistan Valley indica (I've heard this strain is crud but it won't hurt to have a look), Dutch Passion Durban Poison and Ace Seeds Malawi Gold (all regular seeds).
     
    I'm not expecting much from the Dutch Passion DB and I fully intend to procure a packet of Seeds of Africa's Durban Poison and a packet of their Malawi Gold too. If I can find a decent male from either company's Malawis and a decent male and female of DB I am half way there. I can cross the Malwawi with the DB to shorten up the flowering times, a simple square back into the Malawi father would be interesting. And keeper DB's of both sexes would be ideal, I'd grow out a pure DB clone or two every run  B)
     
    So for my indica parent for the F1s I'll be relying too heavily upon the World of Seeds Afghan Kush and their dubious Pakistan Valley beans I have.  If I don't find a keeper in the Afghan Kush I'd consider growing out another packet as I have read that you can get a classic indica from this strain.  
     
    Still, having decided that Durban Poison and Durban Poison/Malawi Gold cross are my sativa strains, I am looking for several landrace/IBL indicas to match them up with.
     
    Sensi's Hindu Kush is one I'm seriously looking at. Also Ace Seeds Chitral Kush looks interesting from a guerrilla grow point of view - both the DB and Malawi have purple phenos that would cross nicely purely on looks. Any more? 
     
    All suggestions appreciated  :)
     
  11. I'm discussing IBL Afghan and other top Indica's in another thread. It appears that only a small handfull of "true" Indicas exist. The Afghan region has seen tons of seed/land/tradition swaps due to war/poverty etc.
     
    Tom Hill, X-18, Pre 88 g-13/Hash Plant (available as Ghash and its siblings from ndnguy), Tom Hill Deep Chunk and quite possibly the real Chem Dawg are about all there is.
     
    La Confidential, Mr Nice (G-13/HP post 88), Bubba Kush, also look pretty solid for heavy Afghan traits.
     
    I am looking into Lapis Mountain right now. The grow reports look stellar.  I might use it to cross my Mr Nice to get a 4 way Afghan/Paki
     
    Totally of the subject....in the other thread a lot of great growers have chimed in about the history of potency. The Chem Dawg, NL5 x Haze A (an old dutch cut) and G-13/HP are emerging as the winners of the most influential crazy potent lines. Karma just dropped a 3 way hybrid of those strains. It might just be the most royal strain ever released. Maybe its gonna suck...lol but I doubt it. 
     
  12. PM me i might be able to help with a nice strong DP strain its a maine staple

    Old man of the mountian
     

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