Hey man, right back at you. To each his/her own. Never made the intention that anyone MUST do this. I just simply states that it does work...Slick. Not everything needs to be prepackaged with a fancy label. Been in the game going on 30 years, run the gamut from tap water to toilet water, banana peelings to egg shells. It's called experimenting. You want to get into a pissing match, go do it with the 20somethings.
Who the Fuck is trolling, Jack?? You were the one who brought the subject up. What's the matter? Did I hurt your little feelings by pointing out a fact? Not quite the elitist you thought you were? Trolling, give me a fucking break... Ok, defoliation. Go for it. Trim them bitches, and do it hard and heavy. Supercrop the holy fucking hell out of them. You just might be surprised with the results regardless of your idol Jorge says.
The results of leaf trimming would not surprise me at all. Like most new growers, it was something I did. I have not tried buying kegs of club soda or saving toilet water, but we did have time to test some of basics that seemed logical. As you get more grows under your belt, you are able to tell myths/stoner thoughts from fact. Keep an open mind, you will get the results you desire with the right attitude and time. You being in the game 30 years, how many indoor harvests have you had in that time? I have an open mind and ready to learn. Keep it friendly GreenMtn Original 1969
I personally dont remove the plants solar panels unless I really have to, I know people that do and people that dont and tbh I dont see a big difference in yield.
@[member="Rumpleforeskin"] always a pleasure seeing you spread good common sense.. cheers man. lotsa stoner science being thrown around still..
Defoliation causes 1 single thing on a plant; Stress. Even low quantities of defoliation can stress a plant. Stress results in slower growth. If you need more light penetration, grab a couple 23 watt CFL lights and hang them alongside the plant to allow for better light coverage. Otherwise, try LSTing it into a flat canopy to minimize the necessity of the extra lighting. I even tried it last time I did a run to prove to myself that it was just what AugustWest said: Stoner Science. Just because your plant APPEARS to be getting better lighting, doesn't mean it's going to help. If you stress a plant it'll cause problems, be it prolonged flowering and vegetation periods, or even hermaphroditism. ... If you GENUINELY have a need to allow more light penetration or coverage, do not cut off the leaves. Either tuck them or tie them down. The difference will be notable in your time from seed/clone to cured bud, as well as quality and quantity of bud. The only time you should EVER remove a leaf is if it is infected, moldy, or when it has become yellow enough that it just falls off when you touch it. Just because it looks pretty and sounds cool doesn't mean you need to do it.
Good to see you AW. I hear ya, I think we both know BS when we hear it. I am pretty good at sifting it out. I don't operate on complete absolutes that don't have any give for commonsense. I will remove a branch that is in the way or turning black. I have removed leaf from dead areas. I do try and do all my pruning and plucking before flowering starts when ever possible. The plants are tuff and will bounce back from damage, but try and keep it to a minimum. I do have a lot of friends who lollypop (I do a very light version of this), but it is all done before the switch (if done correctly). Anyone who has grown for a few years (much less 30 years) knows this to be very common knowledge. Unrealistic practices based on a well written theories should be taken with a bit of caution. Your technique should be sustainable and kept pretty simple. Keep in mind that anyone can come on here and tell you they have been growing for 20+ years and know how to fix your grow room. All I ask is that you make sure the advice you get is from someone who can show you his grow room and the results you plan to mirror (not just talk). Peace, R.
Rumpleforeskin you are being a bit of a dick. I am sure you are capable enough to understand why its condescending to repeatedly call someone "slick" and backhandedly accuse them of trolling. It's also not so unreasonable to imagine using soda water just like it's not so unreasonable to imagine someone purchasing an entire reverse osmosis deionization system for their plants. That being said, the article VTyanky refers to about soda water isn't credible. They say themselves the t value was .135 which is ridiculously low. I am a statistician and this value would literally tell you that we are just as likely to observe the difference in growth between the sets of plants as a result of random variation, there is no statistical significance there.
I can see how you can think I was being a dick by using the word Slick. Sorry for that, but it is the way I talk in person. I have a tendency of calling you Big-Guy, Slick, or My Brotha (depending on my mood). I will edit. That article is wrong in a few other ways. It calls carbonated water and club soda the same thing. Only club soda has minerals, carbonated water is just that. Ok, now you are wrong as well (I won't call you slick my brotha). What would be a reasonable cost to water? How much does it cost you to fill your three bucket DWC system and how often do you change your water? My system takes seven gallons and I change it out every seven to ten days during flowering. Soooo, lets say a liter of Club-soda costs $2. Seven gallons works out to about 26.4978825 liters. So over $50 to change my reservoir with club soda. My RO system $139.00 (click here) but it will produce hundreds of gallons of pure water. I could go on, but I think you get my point. Not unreasonable? Really? Keep it simple and sustainable. Sorry for being a dick.
I grow inside and remove only dying leaves or leaves that are seriously shading a growth site. I'd day it dosent stress the growth of the plant iMO more than a day if that no where nearly as long as super cropping fim ming or topping and the plant reaches up with other sites so that all my branches bush oUT similarly vs the Christmas tree thing. I've tried LST however it's simply not worked to keep my plant as even and bushy as moderate defloration. View attachment 1574607 Also I grow using Rumpleforeskins bubble buckets which are immaculate btw.
I'd also like to add I defoliate the way dude from growweedeasy.com defoliates. I don't do it as extreme as he does (if a leaf can be folded and stay folded I will bend it down, though this only seems to work on the largest leaves) but removing a few leaves strategically to allow for more light penetration works for me. He makes a good point semi against lollipopping too. The tops are given. If you fight for and manage to get dense popcorn at the bottom that's just bonus. And yes. Obviously if I could grow a plant outside with the power of the sun and the airation of the wind I wouldn't touch the plant. But in a controlled environment the plant must be controlled to be efficient. The idea that human interaction only hampers any plant is simply a denial of the history of cultivation The corn you eat. The fruit you eat have all been altered. I don't see how people can say Scrog or fim but not a tempered strategic defoliation. That being said it should be obvious to not pull leaves that aren't in the way just for sake of the practice. I'd rather grow these sites than a fan leaf. (These were covered and lagging while under a single huge fan leaf. In only 3 days after the removal of the leaf they have reached up to the canopy and developed. And the idea that healing the removed leaf takes a shit ton of energy is simply redicules. If you get a cut the cells at the site coagulate, die, dry, and seal off the wound. The plant "scabs" the same way. In the wild, it must deal with insects, animals, falling branches, storms.. etc it is prepared to lose a leaf or two, especially if that means more light to more of the plant as well as better air circulation.)
I posted on here a while back when there wasn't as much activity, I just put rubber bands around the large fan leaves that get in the way of bud sites. I fold them up like little Chinese fans lol its the best of both worlds you don't have to cut off any leaves, there's no stress to the plants, and i get a lot more light coverage after banding 10 -12 leaves. I've done this with 3 grows so far, each time having a control plant and every single time the control loses.
After a few grows under my belt, having dealt with spider mite, neighbours with big noses, mold, nute lock, heat problems e.t.c. e.t.c and beat them all (at least partially) I decided I was finally a bone fide horticulurist. Due to the aforesaid spider mite and mold I figured defoliation along wth heavy training looked like a solution. I began to lolipop and remove a few leaves in mid veg ( a foot tall) removing a few here and there until flower time. At about 3 weeks near finish of stretch I gave them a serious trimming when I could see every single bud with an inch of leaf around bud sites, I was astonished how fast the leaves grew back. I kept trimming only the biggest leaves here and there until week six( 9 week strain) when I attacked them again. I was horrified after ten days and hardly any leaves grew back at all. Slowly, slowly the leave grew back to about 2 inches. Tinking I was looking at another screw up I watched the buds triple in pungent, rock hard girth which was very easy to trim. A few scary moments but 40 oz off 8 plants compared to a normal 16.. Go for it.
I defoliate throughout the plants life cycle. But never touch a healthy leaf. Whenever I see a yellow leaf or a retarded leaf, pluck pluck. I usually end up with fat colas on short bushes.
I remove leaves that have peaked already and are on the start of their decline. You can see the change in color. I have done this for years with Bonsai trees. You can direct and control your growth by manipulating the plants. Cause specific parts to burst with new growth, this is nothing new and has been done for thousands of years. I don't get why weed people constantly argue over stuff like this as if this plant behaves differently than every other plant in the world.
People have been doing wrong things to plants and animals for thousands of years. And some will continue to do wrong stuff. I agree.
i aggressively deleaf my plants. and my yields have always improved. I've been growing for a very long time and like many here, i refused to deleaf my indoor and outdoor plants. until i did and wondered why it worked so well. then i started experimenting. a plant takes better to deleafing at a certain point in bloom. when your largest nugs are the size of.... of.... hmmmm.... of "almost dimes." that is when it is done. only cut the leaves that have long stems but leave the stems on. if you yank 100 leaves you will have 100 large sores that the plant will want to heal before continuing to grow. but if u cut with some scissors and leave the stem on it will heal faster. eventually the stem will shrivel up. not only will it improve yield but it will improve size on the lower and middle buds.