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California Plant Limits: How Does it Work?


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#1
SantaMonicaMtns

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I have my medical marijuana prescription, and in the lettering of Senate Bill 420, in regard to state maximums, you can possess 6 flowering OR 12 vegetative plants. I'm also in Los Angeles county, in the city of Los Angeles, which adheres to Senate Bill 420 guidelines.

The problem is that big, fat "OR" between the two, and I'm not talking about Oregon.

What if you have 4 flowering plants, and 8 vegetative?
3 flowering, 5 vegetative?
6 flowering, 6 vegetative?

The lettering of the law is not specific to these differences. And, there is a huge difference.

So, what's really the actual policy?

I ask because I have 10 vegetative clones and small plants, and will start flowering 4 within the next few weeks. That leaves me 6 plants that will stay in vegetative growth, that I will prune, to keep small (I have a seperate grow tent for keeping vegetative plants small, with a fluorescent light), so that I can start them after the 4 flowering are harvested. I would also like to clone a few of my best plants. This would keep me within the plant limit of 12, but if 4 are flowering, and 8 are vegetative, then what exactly IS the law regarding my situation?

I won't break the law, and want to mind my own business, otherwise I'd call the local leo myself, if I didn't mistrust them to begin with.

Thanks guys

Edited by SantaMonicaMtns, 18 February 2012 - 07:32 PM.


#2
JV420

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Depends what county you live in my man!

And as sketch as it sounds, you can call the police and remain anonymous, and ask what the up-to-date law for how many you can grow. A cop actually recommended this to me, if you're doing it legal.. You have nothing to hide anyways, even if you did, they got bigger fish to fry.

#3
funkydslr

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There are long standing cases in California that center around how much medicine a patient needs for himself. If you aren't selling it, you need not worry about how many plants are actually blooming.

#4
1sttimegrower

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Or, our court system threw the restrictions out and you can grow as much as you need?
Federal limit is 100 plants and then you can face some harsh judgement; grow 99 or under and your fine.

California Supreme Court: State

#5
FitStoner

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The plant limit in Cali is base on location. Some locations allow up to 99 plants per person or 1,000sqft of canopy.

#6
funkydslr

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60k plants = death penalty

#7
aceguitar

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If you have 4 flowering that's like 8 vegging, hence that word"or". So you can have 4 more veg. If you had 5 flowering you can have 2 veg. Flak to your doctor and say you don't like to smoke and you ingest so you need to have more plants. They can give you a rec for 99 plants.

Edited by aceguitar, 18 February 2012 - 11:37 AM.


#8
SantaMonicaMtns

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If you have 4 flowering that's like 8 vegging, hence that word"or". So you can have 4 more veg. If you had 5 flowering you can have 2 veg. Flak to your doctor and say you don't like to smoke and you ingest so you need to have more plants. They can give you a rec for 99 plants.


How did you arrive at these numbers? Are these written in law, somewhere? With no source, you're just speculating.

California NORML lists these guidelines, as of 2/10/12:
"NOTE: On May 22, 2008, the Second District of California Court of Appeals ruled that the state limits on medical marijuana possession and cultivation established under SB 420 are unconstitutional. The court's reasoning would seem to apply only when the SB 420 numbers are used to limit patients' rights, but has been interpreted otherwise by police who would prefer to ignore them. On January 21, 2010, the California Supreme Court in essence affirmed the ruling.
California NORML strongly advises Prop 215 patients to continue following the SB 420 guidelines – six mature or 12 immature plants and 8 ounces of processed marijuana except where local guidelines specify more. The Supreme Court’s recent Kelly decision has been widely misinterpreted to imply that the limits no longer apply, and that patients can therefore grow as much as they want. In fact, the Court’s decision lets the police arrest anyone who exceeds the guidelines, The only thing it disallows is for the guidelines to be used as a basis for conviction in criminal trials.
So, unless you don’t mind being arrested and dragged into court for a felony trial, where you will have to show that the amount of marijuana you had was consistent with your medical needs, the best rule of thumb is to follow the guidelines. The Kelly decision simply re-affirms the original intent of SB 420, which was to establish reasonable guidelines for arrest - not automatic limits for guilt.
Below is the latest information CaNORML has about local guidelines; check with your local government entities for updates (and please let us know if this page needs to be updated). Localities NOT listed below adhere to CA state default guidelines of 6 mature OR 12 immature plants and 8 oz. of dried processed marijuana."

The NORML info doesn't clarify the Senate Bill 420 6 OR 12 issue, but it does link to the most current state of the law regarding cultivation OVER the Senate Bill 420 6 OR 12 issue. Interestingly, the Senate Bill isn't law, as was passed in California in 1996 (Proposition 215), but instead, the Proposition 215's text does not state a limit on the number of plants and amount of processed marijuana that one can cultivate or possess, respectively. To my knowledge, you must maintain fewer than 99 plants, under a law that I'm not sure exists; still, you can be arrested -- and face trial -- for having greater than 6 OR 12, but in the case that you have over 6 OR 12, and less than 99, you have to face a trial where you must demonstrate a medical need for having over the amount of 6 or 12. If you possess over 99 plants, you go to the pokey.

I wish that I could retain a lawyer for all of this, even though I'm under the 6 OR 12 limit law. They'll never give free advice over the phone, as far as I know. And no, I'm not calling the local LEO, that's an accident waiting to happen. In my experience, it's never smart to tell law enforcement ANYTHING.

Edited by SantaMonicaMtns, 18 February 2012 - 07:15 PM.


#9
1sttimegrower

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Dude.. Don't stress about it. Heres an example why; by law I can flower 6 plants straight in the ground or in gigantic bags yielding me several O's per plant or I can grow a quick 6 plant SoG in three gallon tubs yielding drastically less. I can easily argue the 6 SoG is my personal use, but the 6 gigantic ones obviously service more than me.

So, lets apply this to the court decision. I cant just pop 99 feminized seeds and harvest several lbs per season for myself, because its obvious that I'm moving it at that point. But the decision is meant to allow anyone to grow for themselves without BS complications. So I can throw down 10 seeds and let all 10 flower through because I finish them in 5 gallons; this should last me the year.

With respect to the limits, you have to take into account:
Your skill level. How much are you actually going to pull per plant? Obv someone newer to this would want to compensate by growing a few more because someone better would pull more with less.

How long this crop is supposed to last you; you can argue that you're growing this for your whole years supply of medicine.

How big the plants will get; like I said, a tree differs widely from a SoG plant and local law enforcement will understand that (anyone federal don't hold your breath; unrooted cutting = 12 foot tall 20 lb yielding tree)

Also, take into account you live in california. I had 99 plants outdoors going once (for a collective, though) living literally 2 blocks away from the police station. If clubs can have 99 plant grows, whats stopping a group from the same?; by the same logic, if profiteering clubs are allowed to operate, why should law enforcement feel the need to especially crack down on patients attempting to supply themselves within reasonable limits?

If you want to stay safe, then just follow the 12 point limit. 1 flowering plant = 2 points, 1 vege = 1 point. Its not stated anywhere, but that is what is implied within the writing. No need to attack ace, as there is no other information around; You've read the laws, I've read em, thats what they are plain and simple - any other writing are peoples thoughts and opinions (such as this whole 12 point system) If you want to be 100% safe you should just follow the law strictly: you can have 12 veging plants and then when you flip flowering you must kill off 6; there is no and/or involved. The law was written to allow for 6 plants; the 12 vege is only to account for non-feminization.

Edited by 1sttimegrower, 18 February 2012 - 10:10 PM.


#10
aceguitar

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That is why it says OR. It is simple math. I think most people get nervous cuz they think that's not enough. Unless your growing commercially or for resale it usually is plenty. I would doubt if going over 1 or 2 plants is something to stress. How is what I said wrong when you read your answers. Thanks. He's right. 6 OR 12. Don't you think you can have a combination of these? Do you think if you had 6 veg and 3 in flower you'd get in trouble? c'mon. Don't you think you can have a combination or do you think you can only have 6 flower? Like I can't flower 2 and veg 8 more at the same time? Some people just like to hear themselves.

#11
aceguitar

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And yes don't call the local Po Po and ask !!!

#12
Degrassmann

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Calling the cops for rules on MMJ? That's like asking a robber what day of the week is good for you.. and that's crazy that there is a death penalty for pot plants, how sadistic. Here in AZ we can have 12 each, doesn't matter how big. Fuck the police if they say the plants are too big, wtf is too big? You don't have to be selling it to be growing huge plants. Most people who smoke bomb herb all the time have a really high tolerance, smoking pounds a month. My buddy smokes an ounce a day like it's a pack of cigarettes.

#13
MalibuGym

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I don't understand why you let them govern your life, if you want to grow 20 plants grow 20 plants because you want to not because they say it's okay. I don't ask the government for permission for shit. los angeles is on the verge of a ban anyhow. on the day ban it, does that mean you will take down your grow? when is the last time the local police searched your house?

#14
aceguitar

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No doubt. Just grow what it takes to fulfill your needs.

#15
Degrassmann

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I don't understand why you let them govern your life, if you want to grow 20 plants grow 20 plants because you want to not because they say it's okay. I don't ask the government for permission for shit. los angeles is on the verge of a ban anyhow. on the day ban it, does that mean you will take down your grow? when is the last time the local police searched your house?


When the police come into my grow room, it's a lot better being legal / polite with the police and show them my papers and nothing happens, to being illegal where I'm going to jail. No questions asked.

We are allowed to grow 12 ganja plants, that's fucking awesome for in times like now and for me coming from NY where you would never see this. I don't take advantage of the system, just wanna stay small and have all the bud to smoke everyone up I know :D

#16
SantaMonicaMtns

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Both of you make good points, because on the one hand, I should be able to grow as much as I need, but on the other, I should be grateful to have the freedom that people in other states, don't.

Still, I wish that this 6 or 12 bill was clarified. Why didn't I say "law" instead of "bill," you ask? Because the 6 or 12 limit isn't a law. It's a Senate Bill that has been shot down by the California Supreme Court, in accordance with the actual law, Proposition 215.

#17
SantaMonicaMtns

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Both of you make good points, because on the one hand, I should be able to grow as much as I need, but on the other, I should be grateful to have the freedom that people in other states, don't.

Still, I wish that this 6 or 12 bill was clarified. Why didn't I say "law" instead of "bill," you ask? Because the 6 or 12 limit isn't a law. It's a Senate Bill that has been shot down by the California Supreme Court, in accordance with the actual law, Proposition 215.


I just called and spoke with a representative from the director of the Los Angeles branch of California NORML, Bruce Margolin, who also happens to be a defense attorney specializing in criminal law regarding marijuana. Somehow, I cross matched him to his practice, as well as his position at NORML, by intuition, and realized what I'd found out after I was already on hold waiting to speak to someone. See these sites: List of Marijuana Attorneys and California Chapters | California NORML

What I was told by the representative that I spoke to is the following:
Senate Bill 420, specifying the 6 or 12 issue, is no longer the current standard of law enforcement, due to its being struck down by the Supreme Court of California. Therefore, you can grow as many plants as your recommendation from your prescribing physician states on the physical copy of your medical marijuana referral. She did not state that the number of plants to stay below is 99, but I'm assuming that to be the high end number, which does not concern me.

What the representative did advise me to do was not alert my neighbors to what I'm doing, so as to avoid having police come over, in the first place.

#18
1sttimegrower

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^ IMO, one should NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT be grateful for a freedom you ought to have anyways. Add a couple more NOTs to that list, and imagine me as a drill officer, spittle flying from my mouth, booming out each word at the top of my lungs.

The 99 plants is just to stay below 100, at which point the feds can come in and really lay down the hurt(at least 5 years jail, fines, etc).

Thank you for following up with your posts; now any GC member with half a brain can use this and feel safer about growing (within California, at least)

#19
sgtstadanko

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Just go on ca normal site an it will say way your county laws are. They are all different.




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