God/Jesus/religion enough is enough

[Chirstiandude]

Id just like to clear up some of the things on this forum
I respect your views on your own religion,but please do not go prancing around spreading false accusations about mine
Id liked to clear some things up with you guys so here goes:


1: Who is Jesus
Jesus is God in flesh.

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God . . .and the Word became flesh and dwelt among us. . . ," (John 1:1,14).
"Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last, ¹⁸and the living One; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades," (Rev. 1:1718)."Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: 'I am the first and I am the last, and there is no God besides Me," (Isaiah 44:6).

Their is only 1 God (Isaiah 43:10; 44:6,8; 45:5,14,18,21,22) There is only one God who is three persons: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Each is not the same person as the other. Yet, there are not three gods, only one.Theirs three different ones because they each display a different attribute,but their very aware of their own existance(wtf moment) They are simply different forms of the same person like how water appears in 3 different forms(liquid,solid,gas) hm...water is a life giving force,according to science water is a necessity in order to create/hold life.



2:What is His purpose?
Jesus came to earth to get rid of all our sins(you know the bad stuff we do)he died for all of our sins on the cross.

He also came to reveal who is boss.
(Matt. 11:27)

Came to save the world
(John 3:17; Luke 19:10)

To bring division (Luke 12:51)
"Do you think I came to bring peace on earth? No, I tell you, but division."

destroy Satan's power (Heb. 2:14)

*note these are just some of the things he came to do,theirs more but am a bit sleepy



3:Where did God come from?
Ok,by using the human concept of God aka: "without beginning or end"; "eternal"; "infinite", etc

The bible says he has always existed,even from everlasting to everlasting, thou art God" (Psalm 90:2). And, "Your throne is established from of old; Thou art from everlasting" (Psalm 93:2). Quite simply, God has no beginning and no end. So, where did God come from? He didn't. He always was. (another wtf moment)
To us, the notion of time is linear. One second follows the next, one minute is after another. We get older, not younger and we cannot repeat the minutes that have passed us by. We see a beginning and an end. But God is "beyond the chart." He has no beginning or end. He simply has always been.
Also, physics has shown that time is a property that is the result of the existence of matter. Time exists when matter exists. Time has even been called the fourth dimension. But God is not matter. In fact, God created matter. He created the universe. So, time began when God created the universe. Before that, God was simply existing and time had no meaning (except conceptually), no relation to Him. Therefore, to ask where God came from is to ask a question that cannot really be applied to God in the first place. Because time has no meaning with God in relation to who He is, eternity is also not something that can be absolutely related to God. God is even beyond eternity.
Eternity is a term that we finite creatures use to express the concept of something that has no end and no beginning. Since God has no beginning or end, He has no beginning.


4:If God is all knowing and he knows our future,then how is that free will? God knows the future of what the free will creatures choose. Free will does not stop becoming free because God knows what will happen. For example, I know that if my brother will choose to eat chocolate cake over a bowl full of stinking dead bodies (Lol). If I were to put both in front of his face, it is safe to say she will not eat dead bodies knowing this is not taking away the freedom of my child since she is freely choosing one over the other.God already knows what were going to do,he just sits their watching.Thats why their is rape,killing and murder going around.He can't stop them because that's taking away free will.


5:Why is their evil in the world????
To add that last part of number 4:
we can all agree that if we were to die for someone else then we demonstrated "love" right? We can also agree that we would so much very die for our own children right?

Well God gave his own son to die on earth for all our sins.(a wtf moment)
Its like he planned on having evil in the world,so that his son would die for our evilness,so that their would be no more.
Think about it.....sending your own son to the slaughter....all in order to demonstrate just how much you love them.


6:Why should God make people knowing they are going to hell forever?
"WTF MAN,IF "GOD' LOVES US ALL THEN WHY DID HE MAKE PEOPLE KNOWING THEIR GOING TO HELL!!!!

well...its like this.God made Adam knowing he would rebel against him.He wasn't going to stop him or do anything about it.God initial made Adam good,again it was Adam's choice to rebel.So God create more people knowing some will be good,others bad.He can't stop them or change their decisions.So........instead why not create a place similar to prison but a million times worse.Ya that'll help make some of these bad people make better decisions.....but we can't have them knowing for a fact that am real...we gotta have some doubts,some contradiction's,some illogic because if they knew I was real everyone would be doing what I said they should be doing(which is what i want) thats taking away free will.
God wants us to have faith in him,he wants us to know that he exist against all odds,he wants us to decide in whether we believe him or not.The sad thing is that in revelations,When Jesus returns the Christians will be instantly sent to heaven while the rest will be stuck on earth for quite some time.During this time they'll get a second chance.Another thing is that during this time is when their literally be hell on earth.Famines,droughts,wars,plagues.etc
The signs of his coming is when things start to heat up in the middle east The us will no longer be a super power country.The place where bablyon will(Iraq)

fun fact:bin laden is dead,did you know?


7:How do i avoid this?
its simply,believe in God!!!!! all you gotta do is simply accept the fact that he is lord.That came to save your butt
why else would we come knocking on your doors at 7 in the morning...
all around the world their are ancient records of a massive flood(Noah's arch) records of a person who rose in the middle east,each civilization has a different name for this dude,but their all the same person: Jesus




8:blah blah blah let me go to "hell" it aint so tough
umm....hell is supposedly the scariest place ever created.You die and put together again painfully.Spending the rest of eternity in physical,emotional and psychological torture.everlasting pain and torment...but hey if you want to go see if its the real deal....more power to ya
Satan is one bad mofo.He doesn't force someone to do something,he simply twists the truth.He manipulates people,just look at what he did to Adam and eve.



9:So whats this heaven thing?
heaven is the exact opposite,you can do whatever you want how ever you want.Wanna re play your life with super powers done! want to see what it was like to live in 1787 done! want to smoke the best dang weed eva! done!
btw once your in heaven it is impossible to get sad/depressed.It can't happen.You have to be happy,high,and live in total state of euphoria.bummer isn't it



*note weed came from the earth,God said all things on earth is good.Problem comes when you place something over God.That is a big no no,nothing can be place over him...thats why weed has those "side effects" its just a caution tape so that you don't get addicted to it and let it take over your life.


10:OK I BELIEVE WHAT ARE THE BENEFITS!!!
once you accept the truth that God exist,you'll be able to ask him for favors/advice.God loves talking to people and hearing what you have to say even if he knows what your gonna say/do.(crazy dude really :P)
God answers all of your prayers,sometimes their not what you except it to be.Another thing to note is that God will "test" you sometimes by putting you in dangerous situations.This "test" is to see if your faith is still strong in him.If you pass you'll be rewarded,failed and God will simply distance himself from you.Every time you feel your faith is slipping it hurts God.


11:Ok...some questions that my fellow non believer friends ask:

The bible has been written so many times that it can't be trusted.Plus their are pages that were taken out,what now dude!!!
The fact is that the Bible has not been rewritten. Take the New Testament, for example. The disciples of Jesus wrote the New Testament in Greek and though we do not have the original documents, we do have around 6,000 copies of the Greek manuscripts that were made very close to the time of the originals. These various manuscripts, or copies, agree with each other to almost 100 percent accuracy. Statistically, the New Testament is 99.5% textually pure. That means that there is only 1/2 of 1% of of all the copies that do not agree with each other perfectly. But, if you take that 1/2 of 1% and examine it, you find that the majority of the "problems" are nothing more than spelling errors and very minor word alterations.
So when that we translate the Bible, we do not translate from a translation of a translation of a translation. We translate from the original language into our language. It is a one step process and not a series of steps that can lead to corruption.


What about the lost books and the missing pages!!!

1 these "lost" books/pages never claimed to be apart of the word of God.
2 they were never lost,we knew about them
3 their not motivational and had some serious historical inaccuracies
4 they were written by people who were basic peasants look to make a quick buck

*note the book of mary was not included because back then girls were...um......"stupid"
and they were pretty jealous and did not consider her book worthy,but her book is very similar to the other guys


God is great blah blah,but why do kids have to suffer
good questions,the little ones have done nothing to deserve punishment and torture(rape,bondage,ownage.etc) "if God is all loving why doesn't he stop it!"

God made Adam good,and since Adam is a representative of the entire human race....when he sin we all sin.We inherited his sin(its stupid i know) now since God place Adam in charge of the world,his sinfulness infected the earth.Sin is defined as:death disaster and decay.Furthermore, since we are made in the image of God and we are not robots without free will, God has given to us the stature and responsibility of managing what has been given to us. Therefore, God has given us a world that was good to begin with, but fell because of Adam. In this world, because we are like God in that we have responsibility and free will, we live with the consequences of our actions. Unfortunately, the consequences of sin is that sometimes the innocent suffer. :/
look at the bright side,kids get a free pass and get sent straight to heaven because they do not know right from wrong.

Should we obey governments that are bad?
lol no.You are also allowed to kill a man so long as it is for the right reasons(saving a life)
I personally would rather not to because i have no right to end someone's life.


Whats are purpose here on earth
simple.To have as much fun as possible until you die.
God does not want us to be happy.When were sad he's sad,imagine 4.5 billion people being depressed,omg thats sadness.
He wants us to live our lives as happy as possible while loving him.Is that so much to ask?Death is not suppose to be a bad thing.Its beautiful,who wouldn't want to leave this dreadful planet and go to a place of eternal happiness?
I get the question of "what if i don't make it" you will so long as you beilieve he exist.Jesus said "if you deny my existence before man,Ill deny your passage into heaven"


last one:Jesus was a magician who made people hallucinate about His miracles
In other words, countless people were all seeing Jesus do things that were not really happening and it was Jesus who was perpetrating this deception upon them. Let's take the account of where Jesus feeds the five thousand with five loaves and two fish (Matt. 14:19-21). Though it is certainly possible to have one person hallucinate about this, how do the critics account for five thousand people hallucinating about the same thing at the same time? Or how about the resurrection? How do the critics explain the accounts of Jesus appearing to the disciples with holes in His feet and hands? How did Jesus get numerous people to believe a lie about His resurrection (a mass hallucination?)
after the Romans, who were experts at executions, not only flogged Him severely, beat Him, and hung Him on a cross for six hours and then pierced His side where water and blood came out? How did Jesus do that?
Hallucinations are misperceptions, false interpretations of reality. It is certainly possible for a single person to have a hallucination about something. But, how do you get two, three, or four people to misperceive reality and claim to see the same thing at the same time -- like Jesus' resurrection? That is very difficult to do. In fact, have you ever heard of a group of people succumbing to a mass hallucination and all of them believe the same thing?
Also, did Jesus teach His disciples how to do mystical and/or mind control techniques? If that is so, then where is the evidence? Merely claiming that Jesus could do it, does not mean that it is true. There must be some compelling evidence to support the claim. Simply stating that miracles cannot happen and this must mean that Jesus was a magician or some sort, is begging the question. In other words, the critics assume to be true the thing they are trying to prove; namely, that miracles cannot happen.





Finally last note
I just want to know,why is it so hard to simply believe in this guy?
Are you guys scared or something? Does science always have to be right? are you gonna start saying "O science,O my science,Science damnt"
Religion is based on faith,You can't prove it or disprove it you just gotta believe in it.
Its the same thing like gravity.You know its their,but you can't see it touch it or taste it you just know its their.
I mean if you think about it,a couple hundred years ago you could be killed for saying that the earth wasn't the center of the universe.These guys weren't stupid,they built massive structures that in today's society,we would have to use cranes and computers to recreate.A builder once said that the romans were so good at building these large buildings it's simple unreal,they had this stuff down to prefect.The only ones to build a complex pipe system throughout their city.The Egyptians built pyramids with blocks that weigh like 3 tons each and we still don't know for sure how they did it!
These guys were no joke,yet they all thought the earth was the center of universe.The Egyptians thought that pharaohs were God's
and they were wrong
Consider the possibility that you could be wrong.


anyways thxs for reading dudes and dudettes,if you wanna argue or wanna point out some "flaws" be my guest.

[Chirstiandude]

if your still not convince ill give u a briefing on my life:
Ive never felt more happy than i ever have before.

for the past....15 years of my life i was in some hot stuff.very depressed.Tried to kill myself multiple times,had no friends and whoever i was hanging out with made fun of me for being a Christian.I never disrespect their religion at all.I respected their views yet they mocked me...not to mention the stuff that was going on in my family life.Things really got bad when the girl i love made me feel useless and awful.I had to go to the hospital because i was having some crazy heart attack....

*Fast forward*

now am working out and i got some massive muscles and am look mad sexy
I fight now and i can do some of the stuff you see in kung fu movies
girls are chasing at me left to right and I don't even know what to do with them its crazy!!!!
the same girl that treated me like crap now wants me! all of my so call friends hate me more than ever,but its cool because i got a ton more.By some act of God I did a complete 360 on my life.I can get free weed whenever,and am not talking about mids either!!!!!!!! woot woot!

things are crazy....I remeber i specific ask God to help me become a better person and I feel Im reaching my goal.Ive stop doing what people wanted me to do and ive started chasing my dreams and ambitions.Did i mention the amount of girls that are chasing me?

dont get me wrong things still get crazy,like right now my family is breaking apart and my friends family is really in a jiffy.plus i think ill b both deaf and blind idk,hope not tho...

Funny thing is I can't handle the attention,cuz i am not worthy to be treat like a king.I hate it.Id rather be famous by a symbol.

ive also realize that no matter where you go and what you do people are always going to hate you cuz their jealous.I pity the fools

[pavlakos]

its too bad you cant bang any of those girls before you get married though...you know, because god says so.

[Mastodon]

<a href="http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y157/JoeOlmeda/?action=view&current=BlackJesus_WEB.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y157/JoeOlmeda/BlackJesus_WEB.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

SRS BIZ.

[effektz]

I'm sorry to say but God isn't like gravity. You know why? We can prove gravity exists. Just because we can't see it, we know it's there because we can prove it. You cannot even come close to saying the same thing about god.

As for your free-will comment. If god knows whats going to happen, it's not free will. You need a new definition and your example is outrageous. Free will isn't about having the choice between cereal and dead bodies. It's saying "fuck the food" getting up and not eating anything. Did you or your god see that coming?

I also love how you say "It's okay to kill another human", like you get to impose your morality on everybody else just because you have an invisible friend who writes books. I'm not saying I disagree with your assertion, but you can't claim a monolopy on morality.

"Its like he planned on having evil in the world,so that his son would die for our evilness" If he didn't "play on having evil", that would make him a pretty shitty all-knowing all-powerful god wouldn't it? Infact, not only did he have to plan for evil, HE HAD TO CREATE THE EVIL. God did create everything right? He made the universe how he wanted it, and he knows everything that will ever happen in his universe. That would mean he created evil, and made evil people do thos evil things. Now we're gettin gback into free-will which you're wrong about too.

And what about the parts in the bible God was ... not to happy in? Like the part where he says we have to stone to death disobedient teenagers. this means if you've ever talked back to your parents or dis-respected them, you shouldn't have a problem dying for your sin. You ever worked on Sunday? Death. Slavery! Do you own a slave?, because God thinks you should. What about sex? Are you a virgin? I assume you're not married, so there's another sin for ya. And how about homosexuals? They're gods children too right? Why would be abandon part of his greatest creation because they exercised free-will, which god chose to give them.

Anyway those are just a few of my thoughts. I think you're dead wrong but I won't be any more dis-respectful than that.

[effektz]

"all around the world their are ancient records of a massive flood(Noah's arch) records of a person who rose in the middle east,each civilization has a different name for this dude,but their all the same person: Jesus"

Your sort of right. There was a massive flood, BUT NOT A WORLD WIDE FLOOD LIKE THE BIBLE SAID. And it's true many religions have this flood in their creation stories, but I find it hilarious how you admit that, but then promply say "It was Jesus". You know, like yeah those other retards saw the same thing, but they're still wrong about THEIR religion, MINE is still right. They saw MY god, not their god. That's a little arrogant. If you were born in the middle east, I'm sure you wouldn't believe it was Jesus who died for your sins.

[Sam_Spade]

Greetings,

Spectacular FAQ if you disregard academic debate. And I don't mean to be cheeky about that. If you put aside logical consistency for a moment, you just made a very thorough personal religious doctrine.

Although I would love to engage you in many of dozens of points; it would likely be fruitless because of the first point mentioned.

All I would ask, is that you read this for further consideration and perhaps we can have a productive discourse in the future.

http://www.criticalthinking.org/star...ge_student.cfm

Yours Truly,
Sam_Spade

[Zylark]

The OP is a great example of circular logic. Christianity is true because it says so in its holy book, the bible

And a plethora of other fallacies. Strawmen, misconceptions forwarded as premises, post hoc etc. In short not a very good argument.

But at least we got a new true believer on this part of the forum. Indeed, one that is not that happy that his religion is the target of some criticism. Might get entertaining

[DirtyPete]

Because the bible isn't an accurate historical account, your entire thread is null and void.

Jesus was a fraud, a sentient being called 'God' is a fantasy and you are living a lie.

Dogmatic religions are what is wrong with humanity.

I was raised catholic and fail to see how anyone who is of my generation could ever be duped by such an obvious money making scheme as the Catholic Diocese.

Christianity, Judaism, and Islam are all scams and their followers are brainwashed.

[smokeythehare]

I'm seriously wondering how long it took him to type all this shit out lol.

[Chirstiandude]

pavlakos
if i get married,Im trying not to but...alas


effektz
I knew some of you guys were going to object me mock me,whatever i didn't care.Did I ever force you to do something no,i just knew what was going to happen.Same thing like knowing that tomorrow a person will die.Did I have anything to do with his death nope,besides the fact that i knew his time was up.btw your example is pretty crappy


hey all am saying about death is that if your in a life or death situation and someone has to be stop,sadly its the way.

can u please print the verse were it says stoning teenagers?

all sins can be forgiving.All you gotta do is admit your wrong and what you'll do to stop it.Of coarse people sin constantly and repent,but it has to be sincere or else its worthless.

i got nothing against gays,if they wanna be gay more power to them.God gave them free will and their decisions is based off of what they want.

your comment on "it was jesus" is interesting.I don't what happens to a person who happens to be born and raised in an islamic country never knowing who Jesus was.Id assume he would be granted into heaven because all those before Christ got into heaven because they never knew who he was.Only those who had heard of his name and what he had done/represented were giving the opportunity on weather or not on to believe in him

sam spade
thxs
funny thing,I spent the last couple of years trying to reach into my super sub conscious mind.Its weird and i don't know how to explain it but their are times when am able to block out that "voice" in my head.Its so f*** weird and cool because I feel like I have a strong control on my mind.I plan on being a psychologist when I grow up because the human mind is so awesome.But this is a pretty nice site,thxs.



Zylark
To me Christianity is true,because I have faith in it.
I did a test awhile back and I asked God to punish me severely if i ever looked at porn for 3 weeks.So 2 days later I looked at porn and within the following week I got arrest twice,got a call from the school saying am involved in gang related activates,got kicked off from the football team,broke my computer,my family dishonored me because they thought I was gay.The next two weeks were hell.

you can critic my religion as much as you want,doesn't bother me.What did bother me was how the stuff you guys were saying were dead wrong.

dirtypete
how do u know the bible isn't accurate?
i do not that the churches within Christianity are becoming corrupt,like my pastor said.You know its the truth when they talk about stuff and it seems like its towards you.I know some are complete rip offs and their spreading false lies (Jim Jones)

smokeythehare
20mins,I was watching robotchicken
4 years of computer programming can take you a long way


point is,its made not to have logic or reason within it.I don't understand why some of you guys can't comprehend that their is something that is beyond your understanding.Ill never know how God truly works.You honestly cannot tell me that when we die we go no where.
This is what my atheist friend told me how the afterlife works,this kid is a fucking genius


"Imagine dieing knowing that your going to live in a black space.You can't see or sleep,you don't need to eat your just your mind.Your mind living in a empty void forever."


but here is what happened to me when i over dosed on pills.
At 1st the pain was f*** ridiculous,I have never felt something like this in my life.
I remeber my vision went blurry and all i wanted to do was get into the shower.When I touched my hand on the knob I fell and all I saw was white and little black lines going all over the place.I then remeber feeling intensely happy,ive never gotten this happy in my life this beats all my highs together.I didn't see a tunnel or anything but I saw myself lieing on the floor.I saw how the door was a little bit open,how I was like drooling or something outa my mouth and then the next thing I know I was in the hospital.


I talked to one of my friends and he told me that when he drowned he felt really happy too and had the same experiences.

[quankadank]

Originally Posted by DirtyPete

Because the bible isn't an accurate historical account, your entire thread is null and void.

Jesus was a fraud, a sentient being called 'God' is a fantasy and you are living a lie.

Dogmatic religions are what is wrong with humanity.

I was raised catholic and fail to see how anyone who is of my generation could ever be duped by such an obvious money making scheme as the Catholic Diocese.

Christianity, Judaism, and Islam are all scams and their followers are brainwashed.

i believe the same.
You have to have "faith" to believe the bible.
but what is faith? is it to re construct what really happen? how did creation REALLY get here?
is there really a God? or is it just some made up bullshit with no evidence behind it?
i find the bible hard to believe, as well as "God" or "Jesus Christ" of which whom we never see. We cant even PROVE hes around "all of us".
is God gravity? lol
least we can prove gravity exist, we just cant see it.
we cant see "God" either, and all we have is "faith" to rely on, fuck that.

[Chirstiandude]

faith by definition is trust
you just gotta trust it.Like when someone says "trust me man,this is some good shit"

some proof towards the bible:
The Bible tells us that Pharaoh got upset with Moses which led to the demand that the Hebrews make their bricks with half the straw they usually did. Later Pharaoh demanded that they make bricks with no straw at all. If this is true then one would expect to find bricks which were made in different ways at the same construction area. E.g. one with normal bricks, one with less straw than normal and one with no straw at all. Such areas of construction has been discovered. What they found was normal bricks, bricks with less straw and bricks with no straw. Instead of straw what they found was other material such as twigs, small branches etc. Therefore what they found is consistent with what is told in the Bible.


personally I don't think gravity exists,in school were taught that gravity is the attraction by two objects.If you look it up on the internet,but their are some planets and galaxies that are moving way faster than their suppose to be,the pioneer spacecraft is slowing down in ways that don't make sense.These things are contradicting the theory of gravity.not to mention that they are "theory's" they aren't nesscarly the truth,you just simply believe in it to be true.

laws of science are general principle based on observation,my teacher told me its very possible for their to colors we don't know about or for things to work differently on other plants then they do here,because its all relative to what we have here on earth and what we see.

[CosmicSerpent]

Hey look, another morphyx!

I choose not to believe in Jesus because there is not a shred of evidence that he ever existed. I will agree that there are some short sections of the Bible that have been found to contain truthful information about the ancient world, mostly from the Old Testament... but more than 90% of it is lacking in evidence.

However, I'm not saying that I know for sure Jesus never existed.... no one does. Actually, I think there probably was a figure that Jesus was based on who lived sometime in the 1st century.... however, his story was most likely embellished to the point where it now bears little resemblance to the truth.

[DirtyPete]

I don't know why you assume we don't believe in a higher power just because we think Christianity is bunk.

Think about this though, if there is an afterlife then why would it be separated into heaven and hell? It would make more sense to assume that it would be much like our experience in this life where positive/negative forces coexist together, not separate into their own existences.

Also, I don't rule out a sentient creator but to assume there is a creator capable of answering prayers and intervening in our lives is naive, especially when you base that assumption on book that is thousands of years old and was written by men who, at the time, led very barbaric and ignorant lives.

You talk about trust and faith, I trust my own experience and perceptions over a something as ridiculous as the bible.

Faith and spirituality aren't exclusive to strict dogmatic religious cults.

I'm all for live and let live, but I don't have to respect the silly thing people believe in.

In conclusion, the bible sucks.