What if you're wrong ?

magg0t · #1 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 03:46 PM

What if you're wrong atheists...why take the chance?

From alt.atheism

Veritas writes:

"Atheists say there is no God but you stake your immortal soul on this. What if you're wrong? What then Why take the chance?"

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

V replies:

I don't claim there is a God or not. I am an agnostic freethinker.

See:

http://jesusneverexisted.org/jne/forum/index.php?topic=470.0

Nor do I know if there is an entity that is responsible for intelligent design or a universal power such as Karma or other supernatural phenomena at work...I just don't know.

Immortal Soul?

Again, I don't know.

Even if it was discovered that humans came from an alien experiment eons ago that dropped off some inferior specimens to the earth to see what would happen...this would qualify as something supernatural to me and godlike in its scope.

But when it comes to Yahweh I'd stake a 85% chance he is man made.

And if I am wrong I'd take my lumps in hell as Yahweh is not a good God to worship even if Yahweh was real. We all have to live within certain moral and philosophical guidelines if we wish to be at peace. And the idea that Yahweh is a good, all loving, peaceful God is just man made fantasy if one bothers to read what it says about Yahweh in the bible.

See coming to peace with the 'Hell test' below.

Also see 'Would God approve of God':

http://jesusneverexisted.org/jne/forum/index.php?topic=318.0

When it comes to faith...faith must always be based on the fact of a 'first see-er' or 'first contact' that is telling the truth. We do not come up with ideas to base faith on all on our own. All religious faith is based on someone else's reports. If this persons report is based on lies, than the faith must evaporate.

So if you want a first hand report as to what God is or is not, go to the source of the faith. But don't make excuses for God and turn God into something that the written report does not show God to be.

All this being said... we ALL serve two higher powers...the God of Nature and the God of Inner Peace. But I do not claim these as Gods in the traditional sense that most people think of God.

See:

http://jesusneverexisted.org/jne/forum/index.php?topic=342.0

When it comes to Yahweh and being at peace with the Hell test? Many atheists have put more time in trying to understand and find God than most theists.

Hermeneutics is a major problem with religious thought. The inability to understand as the need to understand says it all about man made religion.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermeneutics

There is such debate and disagreement as to what the scriptures really mean and the consequences of a 'bad' interpretation will mean everlasting torture and pain in hell? When deciphering code and hidden meanings becomes a life or death proposition, one has to wonder about a God that supposedly put his name on such a muddled up document.

I can also tell you that destroying another being and causing them 'pain and torturing for eternity' will yield the provider of that pain and torture ZERO peace. This concept of pain, eternal hell and karma all smacks of the human touch of 'fear based' religious thought. We can see it in a quote from a Christian list member here:

JesusForgiveThem writes:

"Do you believe in eternal suffering? I surely would hate for anyone to consciously chose to spend an eternity in hell over some foolish pride that they can't get over ... as opposed to opening your heart to Jesus and see what he has to offer before writing Him off completely."

This discussion of eternal suffering that JesusForgiveThem brings up leads us to another problem. Which divinely inspired document does one follow as there are numerous books... all claiming to the word of God? And all these documents conflict with each other? It is with this overlap of these documents that are in agreement that I seek to find peace with.

And anything that conflicts or cannot be substantiated and does not pass my empirical tests I have to let it go as 'man's ego' being injected into the equation. If God wishes to make things clear and without the need for hermeneutics then I am all ears. But until that time, we must each do the best we can and come to peace with this subject for ourselves.

But this problem of hermeneutics is not limited solely to the study of monotheism. It also encompasses the history of Buddhist thought as well. A favorite saying of the Mahayana is that of using 'skillful means' to achieve ones goal. Skillful Means = Put a Spin On It = LIE.

Now, I am not just singling out the Mahayana as the bad boys. Lies and imperfections are widespread throughout all spiritual thought that was ever created my man. Man is imperfect and as such all his religious thought it also imperfect. But within these imperfections there are also many perfection's, as seldom is a thing all good or all bad.

With my own spiritual quest I have evolved into an agnostic freethinker. From the tradition of religion telling massive lies intermingled with some truths (yes the spiritual traditions of the world contain some truth) I have learned to not believe anything that requires faith and cannot be tested and applied as a universal law to the whole of society. I apply this form of thought to all my spiritual traditions I draw from whether it be monotheism to Buddhism or Taoism.

Now some of these spiritual truths are 'lesser truths' and subjective in nature. The application of such relative truth is more or less unimportant and up to the likes or dislikes of the individual. But the larger truths that are universal in nature are what I try to distinguish and then follow. If a concept is not 'crystal clear' and requires much speculation, I let it go. We can see what has happened in religious history when man gets too 'enthused' about interpretation. I do not wish to follow in those footsteps.

How do we know we have made an honest effort at this decoding business? For one, we do not fool with decoding, we just think and test for truth. Number two, we come to peace by giving it the 'hell test.' We work towards moral and ethical principles and develop what is called a 'good heart' which also aligns us magically with the empirical basics of religious thought in the various documents attributed to be the word of God.

If we are successful at this quest and ethically and morally sound, when it comes time to die we can be at peace knowing we have done our best in this area. And if we find out that there is a hell and the entity 'claiming to be God' (for lack of a better name) has domed us to hell from 'not decoding it right' even with our best efforts, we can be at peace with knowing God is an unjust God and not a real God but an alien 'god bully' of sorts.

And when it comes to dying and the title 'loving God', we as imperfect humans that strive to develop a good heart will contain infinity more of that true 'Godly nature' that this 'alien god bully' claming to be God that seeks to torture those that have worked along spiritual lines to be good people.

This is the 'hell test' in a nutshell - you are at peace with your actions and you are authentic as well about your life. When you align Right Actions + Authenticity this equals PEACE - Just as Socrates told his accusers when they condemned him to death. Socrates had no fear of evil in this life or after death:

"Wherefore, O judges, be of good cheer about death, and know this of a truth - that no evil can happen to a good man, either in life or after death."

As I write this post, I am reminded of aliens in an old "Superman" movies that came to earth to tell us to 'bow down' to them or else? Yes, the aliens in the movie had great powers but they were not God...they were just gods to us humans. Seek truth, seek inner peace, seek the development of a good heart and put your best efforts into finding it and you too can be at peace with this subject.

Of course, if one has never found inner peace all that I am telling you is unbelievable to you? Always remember...a wise mans knows what he says and a fool can only say what he knows. Learn to say what you know, and also know right from wrong actions and you can be at peace with your life or any life to come as well.

One last point. If you look at the name of the Christian I quoted above it is JesusForgiveThem it tells an interesting story in itself. If a God needs to be told by JesusForgiveThem or any other of us humans what to do, what is right or wrong and we can sway an omnipotent and perfect God just by begging...then that is one scary God. For we can see what has happened on earth when human demigods have been in power.

See:

http://www.jesusneverexisted.com/burning.html

Cheers!

What'sThatSmell · #2 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 03:51 PM

That makes no sense whatsoever.
Why take the chance with Atheism over Christianity?
Uh, what if both are wrong?
What happened to the other religions?

The only way of being totally spiritually safe would be to follow every single religious doctrine. However in doing so would contradict various rules of a variety of the religions thus making you a 'sinner'.
In which case it is impossible to completely safe with any religious choice..

So, by that regards I think I'll stay Atheist

g0pher · #3 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 04:00 PM

If atheists are wrong ,it still leaves the problem of which religion is right to follow ,What if we spend our life worshipping the wrong god ?If you are going to believe in God ,which God do you choose?

If you choose the wrong one you still go to hell.So it is not just a matter of believing in god you have to believe in the right one or you have wasted your life ,That is something that applies to believers also ,they are just hoping they have picked the right one

We will all enter that eternal darkness from which there is no return

It is obvious that some think they have chosen the right religion, but what if they're wrong ? my point is that we won't know until the final curtain and if your wrong you won't even know then , only if your're right you will no.

My only regret is that at the final curtain I won't be able to turn to you and say "I knew it"

GrowBot · #4 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 04:43 PM

wouldn't it be a shame, if we were to all live by the ten commandments? wouldn't it be a shame if we were to treat each other with excellance? wouldn't it be a shame to spend your life helping others? No....

Shalom Salaam · #5 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 06:29 PM

Believing in something just because your afraid of what will happen if you don't believe in it is NO REASON to believe in it.

Highbinder · #6 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shalom Salaam

Believing in something just because your afraid of what will happen if you don't believe in it is NO REASON to believe in it.

Yeah. You can't just decide to believe in God/religion/whatever because you've weighed it up as a calculated bet. Either you have faith or you don't, nor can you make yourself believe in God.

CosmicSerpent · #7 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 07:04 PM

That's like asking someone why they aren't scared of a giant flying monster coming down from the sky and eating them. If you don't believe in something, then there's no reason to base your life on it. Most religions require faith from their followers, and wouldn't accept someone practicing just out of precaution. In other words, you can't just pretend to believe in something if you really don't.

I'm not atheist, but I don't adhere to a particular organized religion. I guess I would call myself agnostic, except I believe more than likely that a higher power exists. I admit I could be wrong in that presumption. But I personally don't think a god who would make his own existence so impossible to prove would punish those who don't believe in him.

weedseed · #8 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 10:30 PM

most religions could be crossed off the list of "possibly correct". i wont say its because they are farfetched because you could argue that the resurrection of Christ is farfetched..which wouldnt get anybody anywhere.

id say look at the the codes of life in these religions,look at the god in each of these religions and ask yourself if you can honestly believe that there is a six-armed woman or a god (alla ..ala?) who cares nothing about his creation or a (G)od that gives each of us the option to live as we want or one that simply asks you to cherish the earth you live on and its creatures or whatever...

look closely at the kind of life each one asks you to live..the "laws" so to speak..the code...or whatever..

sorry i cant gather all of my thoughts on this topic at this moment..

in my opinion atheism is the only guarantee in which at the end of your life you suffer reprocussions for no belief at all....because....i believe that its no accident that we are what we are by chance...we are superior to every living creature on this planet and if there is no God then i believe maybe guinea pigs or komodo dragons would be able to speak or reach the moon and so on....there would be no reason scientifically(or darwinistically) why we are the only ones who evolved into what we are now..where would the advantage have come from?

id venture to say that there should be no atheists and that we should all choose a higher power to believe in that way we're not throwing away our only chance for an eternal life of happiness.

dont twist what im saying i dont value any person less than another just because their beliefs are different than mine..i do not think im better in any way..i just think that most atheists (not all) are atheists because they couldnt find truth in any religion they saw..which is a valid reason if they actually gave everything they had in order to search for these truths (or proofs)...i think the first mistake you can make as an atheist is to seek these truths using intellect rather than your heart....after all...what does intelligence have to do with religion in the first place?

if you are searching, then search...truly search...dont use your brain use your heart and hopefully the decision you make will be the right one whatever it may be..

XPiperX · #9 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 10:56 PM

I smell a troll.

HighGrowMan · #10 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 11:18 PM

See to me the only way that I can arrive at atheism is if I'm angry about the inactivity, or lack of guidance of God.

Anger = Atheism = Cold = Closed off

If I'm not angry I don't have to make a definitive statement

Complacency = Agnostic = Luke Warm

However, if I am able to understand God, and know his laws then I am able to be spiritual.

Understanding = Spiritual = Hot

3rr0r · #11 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weedseed

id venture to say that there should be no atheists and that we should all choose a higher power to believe in that way we're not throwing away our only chance for an eternal life of happiness.

You cant force yourself to believe something. You either believe it or you don't. I don't believe in the Christian God. Im not going to just say I believe in it just so I have a chance at heaven if Im wrong. If I was wrong I dont think God wants me to just lie about my beliefs.

Quote:

See to me the only way that I can arrive at atheism is if I'm angry about the inactivity, or lack of guidance of God.

Or because you reached a disbelief due to a process of logical thought. Why cant we just exist but a higher "god" can. Does that god then have to believe in a higher creator so he has a reason for existence.

XPiperX · #12 (**permalink**) 11-05-2007, 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HighGrowMan

See to me the only way that I can arrive at atheism is if I'm angry about the inactivity, or lack of guidance of God.

Anger = Atheism = Cold = Closed off

If I'm not angry I don't have to make a definitive statement

Complacency = Agnostic = Luke Warm

However, if I am able to understand God, and know his laws then I am able to be spiritual.

Understanding = Spiritual = Hot

So you just kinda change around? Intelligent people arrive at the conclusion of atheism through logical thought and process of elimination. If this is how you do it then... Hell, that's no better than some angsty thirteen year old goth kid who doesn't believe in a higher power only due to their anger at the world for wronging them, or how bad their lives seem, or some such horse shit. That's just as bad as a person going through a great and amazing time in their life and attributing it to the existence of a higher power which has some how magically favored them above millions and millions of people. Ignorance.

Vincebus · #13 (**permalink**) 11-06-2007, 12:46 AM

I'm gonna go with what everybody said, I am an atheist and fear is no motivation to make me believe in something. Anyways, I wouldn't want to be religious and believe in going to heaven or hell after death, because I assume this is the thing atheists are supposed to fear. Because an eternity spent anywhere be it in heaven or hell, would suck. I don't want to live for ever!

Zylark · #14 (**permalink**) 11-06-2007, 02:40 AM

Just tell me what god to believe in, why and with evidence please. And tell me what makes your particular god the one and only, as opposed to all the other ones. Again, I have to insist upon evidence.

Pascals wager do not work once you realize there is more than one god belief, and they all contradict...

JesusC · #15 (**permalink**) 11-06-2007, 02:52 AM

Im not an atheist, im not agnostic, and im not religious.

I am someone who greatly appreciates the Universe, period. I am a person who takes a lot of time to stargaze, ponder, and appreciate. I have a very deep relationship and appreciation with the Universe in which I live, thats the best I can do....appreciate.

If I die and have to stand before some kind of god, I would think that it would appreciate the fact that I have such respect and admiration for its creation...if thats the case.

If I die and nothing happens, thats also fine with me. When I take my final breath, Ill leave this world with the satisfaction of knowing I spent a great deal of time here on earth thinking about, contemplating, and appreciating these very important things.

Either way, my thinking has led me to believe that atheism is just as foolish as religion. Nobody is certain of anything...but thats no reason to believe in something simply because of the fear that you may be wrong, thats just stupid.

Edit: Sorry if that doesnt make much sense.......

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
What's wrong with me?	the_pirate	Spirituality And Philosophy	16	07-10-2008 01:42 PM
What the hell went wrong?	Smokeycat	Absolute Beginners	10	11-13-2006 10:16 AM
WTF am i doin wrong?	oskillzzo	General Indoor Growing	10	09-25-2006 07:07 AM
FIrst Grow + Photos , something is wrong with leaves	crazyheaD	Absolute Beginners	15	05-14-2006 02:24 PM
Wrong Bannage maybe...	2ndHandSmokee	General Feedback	4	03-20-2006 03:05 AM

Site links

FAQ

Important

Extra

#1 (permalink) 11-05-2007, 03:46 PM
magg0t Registered User Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 54	What if you're wrong ? What if you're wrong atheists...why take the chance? From alt.atheism Veritas writes: "Atheists say there is no God but you stake your immortal soul on this. What if you're wrong? What then Why take the chance?" ********* REPLY SEPARATOR ********* V replies: I don't claim there is a God or not. I am an agnostic freethinker. See: http://jesusneverexisted.org/jne/forum/index.php?topic=470.0 Nor do I know if there is an entity that is responsible for intelligent design or a universal power such as Karma or other supernatural phenomena at work...I just don't know. Immortal Soul? Again, I don't know. Even if it was discovered that humans came from an alien experiment eons ago that dropped off some inferior specimens to the earth to see what would happen...this would qualify as something supernatural to me and godlike in its scope. But when it comes to Yahweh I'd stake a 85% chance he is man made. And if I am wrong I'd take my lumps in hell as Yahweh is not a good God to worship even if Yahweh was real. We all have to live within certain moral and philosophical guidelines if we wish to be at peace. And the idea that Yahweh is a good, all loving, peaceful God is just man made fantasy if one bothers to read what it says about Yahweh in the bible. See coming to peace with the 'Hell test' below. Also see 'Would God approve of God': http://jesusneverexisted.org/jne/forum/index.php?topic=318.0 When it comes to faith...faith must always be based on the fact of a 'first see-er' or 'first contact' that is telling the truth. We do not come up with ideas to base faith on all on our own. All religious faith is based on someone else's reports. If this persons report is based on lies, than the faith must evaporate. So if you want a first hand report as to what God is or is not, go to the source of the faith. But don't make excuses for God and turn God into something that the written report does not show God to be. All this being said... we ALL serve two higher powers...the God of Nature and the God of Inner Peace. But I do not claim these as Gods in the traditional sense that most people think of God. See: http://jesusneverexisted.org/jne/forum/index.php?topic=342.0 When it comes to Yahweh and being at peace with the Hell test? Many atheists have put more time in trying to understand and find God than most theists. Hermeneutics is a major problem with religious thought. The inability to understand as the need to understand says it all about man made religion. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermeneutics There is such debate and disagreement as to what the scriptures really mean and the consequences of a 'bad' interpretation will mean everlasting torture and pain in hell? When deciphering code and hidden meanings becomes a life or death proposition, one has to wonder about a God that supposedly put his name on such a muddled up document. I can also tell you that destroying another being and causing them 'pain and torturing for eternity' will yield the provider of that pain and torture ZERO peace. This concept of pain, eternal hell and karma all smacks of the human touch of 'fear based' religious thought. We can see it in a quote from a Christian list member here: JesusForgiveThem writes: "Do you believe in eternal suffering? I surely would hate for anyone to consciously chose to spend an eternity in hell over some foolish pride that they can't get over ... as opposed to opening your heart to Jesus and see what he has to offer before writing Him off completely." This discussion of eternal suffering that JesusForgiveThem brings up leads us to another problem. Which divinely inspired document does one follow as there are numerous books... all claiming to the word of God? And all these documents conflict with each other? It is with this overlap of these documents that are in agreement that I seek to find peace with. And anything that conflicts or cannot be substantiated and does not pass my empirical tests I have to let it go as 'man's ego' being injected into the equation. If God wishes to make things clear and without the need for hermeneutics then I am all ears. But until that time, we must each do the best we can and come to peace with this subject for ourselves. But this problem of hermeneutics is not limited solely to the study of monotheism. It also encompasses the history of Buddhist thought as well. A favorite saying of the Mahayana is that of using 'skillful means' to achieve ones goal. Skillful Means = Put a Spin On It = LIE. Now, I am not just singling out the Mahayana as the bad boys. Lies and imperfections are widespread throughout all spiritual thought that was ever created my man. Man is imperfect and as such all his religious thought it also imperfect. But within these imperfections there are also many perfection's, as seldom is a thing all good or all bad. With my own spiritual quest I have evolved into an agnostic freethinker. From the tradition of religion telling massive lies intermingled with some truths (yes the spiritual traditions of the world contain some truth) I have learned to not believe anything that requires faith and cannot be tested and applied as a universal law to the whole of society. I apply this form of thought to all my spiritual traditions I draw from whether it be monotheism to Buddhism or Taoism. Now some of these spiritual truths are 'lesser truths' and subjective in nature. The application of such relative truth is more or less unimportant and up to the likes or dislikes of the individual. But the larger truths that are universal in nature are what I try to distinguish and then follow. If a concept is not 'crystal clear' and requires much speculation, I let it go. We can see what has happened in religious history when man gets too 'enthused' about interpretation. I do not wish to follow in those footsteps. How do we know we have made an honest effort at this decoding business? For one, we do not fool with decoding, we just think and test for truth. Number two, we come to peace by giving it the 'hell test.' We work towards moral and ethical principles and develop what is called a 'good heart' which also aligns us magically with the empirical basics of religious thought in the various documents attributed to be the word of God. If we are successful at this quest and ethically and morally sound, when it comes time to die we can be at peace knowing we have done our best in this area. And if we find out that there is a hell and the entity 'claiming to be God' (for lack of a better name) has domed us to hell from 'not decoding it right' even with our best efforts, we can be at peace with knowing God is an unjust God and not a real God but an alien 'god bully' of sorts. And when it comes to dying and the title 'loving God', we as imperfect humans that strive to develop a good heart will contain infinity more of that true 'Godly nature' that this 'alien god bully' claming to be God that seeks to torture those that have worked along spiritual lines to be good people. This is the 'hell test' in a nutshell - you are at peace with your actions and you are authentic as well about your life. When you align Right Actions + Authenticity this equals PEACE - Just as Socrates told his accusers when they condemned him to death. Socrates had no fear of evil in this life or after death: "Wherefore, O judges, be of good cheer about death, and know this of a truth - that no evil can happen to a good man, either in life or after death." As I write this post, I am reminded of aliens in an old "Superman" movies that came to earth to tell us to 'bow down' to them or else? Yes, the aliens in the movie had great powers but they were not God...they were just gods to us humans. Seek truth, seek inner peace, seek the development of a good heart and put your best efforts into finding it and you too can be at peace with this subject. Of course, if one has never found inner peace all that I am telling you is unbelievable to you? Always remember...a wise mans knows what he says and a fool can only say what he knows. Learn to say what you know, and also know right from wrong actions and you can be at peace with your life or any life to come as well. One last point. If you look at the name of the Christian I quoted above it is JesusForgiveThem it tells an interesting story in itself. If a God needs to be told by JesusForgiveThem or any other of us humans what to do, what is right or wrong and we can sway an omnipotent and perfect God just by begging...then that is one scary God. For we can see what has happened on earth when human demigods have been in power. See: http://www.jesusneverexisted.com/burning.html Cheers!

#2 (permalink) 11-05-2007, 03:51 PM
What'sThatSmell RIP Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 6,421	That makes no sense whatsoever. Why take the chance with Atheism over Christianity? Uh, what if both are wrong? What happened to the other religions? The only way of being totally spiritually safe would be to follow every single religious doctrine. However in doing so would contradict various rules of a variety of the religions thus making you a 'sinner'. In which case it is impossible to completely safe with any religious choice.. So, by that regards I think I'll stay Atheist __________________

#3 (permalink) 11-05-2007, 04:00 PM
g0pher A Toast - to the Ganja Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: solon Posts: 898	If atheists are wrong ,it still leaves the problem of which religion is right to follow ,What if we spend our life worshipping the wrong god ?If you are going to believe in God ,which God do you choose? If you choose the wrong one you still go to hell.So it is not just a matter of believing in god you have to believe in the right one or you have wasted your life ,That is something that applies to believers also ,they are just hoping they have picked the right one We will all enter that eternal darkness from which there is no return It is obvious that some think they have chosen the right religion, but what if they're wrong ? my point is that we won't know until the final curtain and if your wrong you won't even know then , only if your're right you will no. My only regret is that at the final curtain I won't be able to turn to you and say "I knew it" __________________ Last edited by g0pher; 11-05-2007 at 04:15 PM.

#4 (permalink) 11-05-2007, 04:43 PM
GrowBot Registered User Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 1,455	wouldn't it be a shame, if we were to all live by the ten commandments? wouldn't it be a shame if we were to treat each other with excellance? wouldn't it be a shame to spend your life helping others? No....

#5 (permalink) 11-05-2007, 06:29 PM
Shalom Salaam Temporarily in Zion Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Brooklyn Posts: 4,096 Blog Entries: 2	Believing in something just because your afraid of what will happen if you don't believe in it is NO REASON to believe in it. __________________ "Heal"

#7 (permalink) 11-05-2007, 07:04 PM
CosmicSerpent Registered User Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,856	That's like asking someone why they aren't scared of a giant flying monster coming down from the sky and eating them. If you don't believe in something, then there's no reason to base your life on it. Most religions require faith from their followers, and wouldn't accept someone practicing just out of precaution. In other words, you can't just pretend to believe in something if you really don't. I'm not atheist, but I don't adhere to a particular organized religion. I guess I would call myself agnostic, except I believe more than likely that a higher power exists. I admit I could be wrong in that presumption. But I personally don't think a god who would make his own existence so impossible to prove would punish those who don't believe in him.

#8 (permalink) 11-05-2007, 10:30 PM
weedseed Registered User Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: neither here nor there Posts: 1,027	most religions could be crossed off the list of "possibly correct". i wont say its because they are farfetched because you could argue that the resurrection of Christ is farfetched..which wouldnt get anybody anywhere. id say look at the the codes of life in these religions,look at the god in each of these religions and ask yourself if you can honestly believe that there is a six-armed woman or a god (alla ..ala?) who cares nothing about his creation or a (G)od that gives each of us the option to live as we want or one that simply asks you to cherish the earth you live on and its creatures or whatever... look closely at the kind of life each one asks you to live..the "laws" so to speak..the code...or whatever.. sorry i cant gather all of my thoughts on this topic at this moment.. in my opinion atheism is the only guarantee in which at the end of your life you suffer reprocussions for no belief at all....because....i believe that its no accident that we are what we are by chance...we are superior to every living creature on this planet and if there is no God then i believe maybe guinea pigs or komodo dragons would be able to speak or reach the moon and so on....there would be no reason scientifically(or darwinistically) why we are the only ones who evolved into what we are now..where would the advantage have come from? id venture to say that there should be no atheists and that we should all choose a higher power to believe in that way we're not throwing away our only chance for an eternal life of happiness. dont twist what im saying i dont value any person less than another just because their beliefs are different than mine..i do not think im better in any way..i just think that most atheists (not all) are atheists because they couldnt find truth in any religion they saw..which is a valid reason if they actually gave everything they had in order to search for these truths (or proofs)...i think the first mistake you can make as an atheist is to seek these truths using intellect rather than your heart....after all...what does intelligence have to do with religion in the first place? if you are searching, then search...truly search...dont use your brain use your heart and hopefully the decision you make will be the right one whatever it may be.. __________________ *"Good philosophy must exist, if for no other reason, because bad philosophy needs to be answered."* -C.S. Lewis Last edited by weedseed; 11-05-2007 at 10:35 PM.

#10 (permalink) 11-05-2007, 11:18 PM
HighGrowMan Deluded within Delusion Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: The Golden City Posts: 1,172	See to me the only way that I can arrive at atheism is if I'm angry about the inactivity, or lack of guidance of God. Anger = Atheism = Cold = Closed off If I'm not angry I don't have to make a definitive statement Complacency = Agnostic = Luke Warm However, if I am able to understand God, and know his laws then I am able to be spiritual. Understanding = Spiritual = Hot

#13 (permalink) 11-06-2007, 12:46 AM
Vincebus Registered User Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 61	I'm gonna go with what everybody said, I am an atheist and fear is no motivation to make me believe in something. Anyways, I wouldn't want to be religious and believe in going to heaven or hell after death, because I assume this is the thing atheists are supposed to fear. Because an eternity spent anywhere be it in heaven or hell, would suck. I don't want to live for ever!

#14 (permalink) 11-06-2007, 02:40 AM
Zylark Old School Stoner Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Norway, on the Westside where it rains perpetually. Posts: 3,808	Just tell me what god to believe in, why and with evidence please. And tell me what makes your particular god the one and only, as opposed to all the other ones. Again, I have to insist upon evidence. Pascals wager do not work once you realize there is more than one god belief, and they all contradict... __________________

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)

#15 (permalink) 11-06-2007, 02:52 AM
JesusC Habitual User Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,359	Im not an atheist, im not agnostic, and im not religious. I am someone who greatly appreciates the Universe, period. I am a person who takes a lot of time to stargaze, ponder, and appreciate. I have a very deep relationship and appreciation with the Universe in which I live, thats the best I can do....appreciate. If I die and have to stand before some kind of god, I would think that it would appreciate the fact that I have such respect and admiration for its creation...if thats the case. If I die and nothing happens, thats also fine with me. When I take my final breath, Ill leave this world with the satisfaction of knowing I spent a great deal of time here on earth thinking about, contemplating, and appreciating these very important things. Either way, my thinking has led me to believe that atheism is just as foolish as religion. Nobody is certain of anything...but thats no reason to believe in something simply because of the fear that you may be wrong, thats just stupid. Edit: Sorry if that doesnt make much sense....... __________________ Last edited by JesusC; 11-06-2007 at 03:21 AM.