What if you're wrong ?

[Totah Sam]

Originally Posted by XPiperX

I smell a troll.

Oh shit! I hope I didn't step in any!

[HighGrowMan]

Originally Posted by XPiperX

So you just kinda change around? Intelligent people arrive at the conclusion of atheism through logical thought and process of elimination. If this is how you do it then... Hell, that's no better than some angsty thirteen year old goth kid who doesn't believe in a higher power only due to their anger at the world for wronging them, or how bad their lives seem, or some such horse shit. That's just as bad as a person going through a great and amazing time in their life and attributing it to the existence of a higher power which has some how magically favored them above millions and millions of people. Ignorance.

Sorry... No I don't just change around on a whim, however that is what I believe is attributed to being atheist, agnostic and spiritual.

In my mind atheists are angry at God and agnostics are complacent.

I understand that many intelligent people arrive at the conclusion of atheism, but that doesn't make atheism intelligent. Don't get mad at me for pointing it out.

That said, the OP's ultimatum is also not very logical; just because something isn't one thing, doesn't automatically make the opposite true.

Although that's the type of logic that get's armies marching to war. Ie; this country may have attacked us, but can we really afford to take the chance that they didn't?

Hell with that logic you can manipulate to your hearts content, all you need is to instill doubt.

[naku06]

Pascal's wager.

[XPiperX]

Originally Posted by HighGrowMan

Sorry... No I don't just change around on a whim, however that is what I believe is attributed to being atheist, agnostic and spiritual.

In my mind atheists are angry at God and agnostics are complacent.

I understand that many intelligent people arrive at the conclusion of atheism, but that doesn't make atheism intelligent. Don't get mad at me for pointing it out.

That said, the OP's ultimatum is also not very logical; just because something isn't one thing, doesn't automatically make the opposite true.

Although that's the type of logic that get's armies marching to war. Ie; this country may have attacked us, but can we really afford to take the chance that they didn't?

Hell with that logic you can manipulate to your hearts content, all you need is to instill doubt.

So, all atheists are angry at something they don't believe in?

That makes absolute sense.

Get it through your head dude- They're not angry at anything, they simply do not believe in it's existence. I don't believe in the tooth fairy- Not because I'm angry at it for not taking my teeth when I put them under my pillow, but because I, through logical thought and reason, concluded it was a fictional creature. That's what an atheist does. You'd have to be pretty damn dumb to not believe in something but be angry at it for it's inaction, when you don't believe in it the first place. That's a contradiction. Ask any intelligent atheist what their reasons are. Not those morons on places like vampirefreaks.com, and no one under, say, 16 ore 17. Intelligent people with life experience. Go for it. Ask them.

You can't be angry at something you don't believe exists. Period.

[JesusC]

Originally Posted by XPiperX

So, all atheists are angry at something they don't believe in?

That makes absolute sense.

Get it through your head dude- They're not angry at anything, they simply do not believe in it's existence. I don't believe in the tooth fairy- Not because I'm angry at it for not taking my teeth when I put them under my pillow, but because I, through logical thought and reason, concluded it was a fictional creature. That's what an atheist does. You'd have to be pretty damn dumb to not believe in something but be angry at it for it's inaction, when you don't believe in it the first place. That's a contradiction. Ask any intelligent atheist what their reasons are. Not those morons on places like vampirefreaks.com, and no one under, say, 16 ore 17. Intelligent people with life experience. Go for it. Ask them.

You can't be angry at something you don't believe exists. Period.

I see what you're saying man, I was atheist for a while so I know where you're coming from.

Although they are the exact opposite regarding belief, atheism and religion go hand in hand because both sides actually believe they are right, with very little evidence to back it up either way.

Your faith in logic leads you to believe there is no god, while faith in a greater power leads someone to follow religion. Either way, faith is a huge part of it.

I think the most important thing is to move away from labels and just learn to appreciate life and everything that comes along with it.

Understanding and Appreciation is key...

Once you gain the full appreciation and understanding (as much as humanly possible) of everything you're a part of, you'll rest easy in the end...one way or another.

[junkiedays]

God: "Oh, let's see here Bob, you donated millions of dollars to charity I see? Fed some third world countries... Built some schools, Big Brother program, fed the homeless... Damn, this is a nice resume. Oh, wait, we have a problem here. I see you aren't a religious person. You don't believe in me, Bob? To Hell with you!"

If that's your God, he's a jackass.

[CoughDrop]

JesusC that is exactly how I feel about spirituality. I used to consider myself an agnostic and eventually realized that knowing if god existed wasn't important. We possibly won't know, even until death, so why ask? It doesn't matter, what does matter is the fact that your here.

Just look at yourself and contemplate what you are, a random assortment of elements and other shit we won't understand for eons--floating through an emptiness that we shouldn't pretend to think we even nearly understand. Now I don't give two shits whether or not some gray-bearded old guy or a massive explosion triggered by some dimension we can't comprehend pushed our universe into existence, I only care that it did happen. That's all that matters.

The fact that my consciousness was able to develop from this nothingness blows my mind.

[dirtydingusus]

as usual i think confusing religin with spirituality is the first mistake people make ...over and over ...how many people are turned away from the truth by religin?

just becouse "they"claim not to be athiest are becoming more and more a religin....they believe ...sorry if i hurt your feelings just the way i see it...


no god who loves us would want us to suffer in hell...duh...

we just dont know the whole story...how could we?

i think religin is a carfully planed out tool to keep people from the truth ...if you are held by the constrants of religin of any kind you are cutting your self off from the larger truth

who is to say we are not in hell right now?running blinly arround trying to find a way out?

no one is even cappable of being perfect....no one...

so we are all doomed....

unless we begin to realize for there to be a "god"(for lack of a better term)he or she cannot posable be all"good" in order for good to be real he must be made of everything ...good and bad...

for there to be two sides is redickuless..


there is only peace where there is balance....and we cannot even begin to apprecate good with out bad to compair it to ...


just like the little rich boy who does not apprecate his expensive toys becouse he never went without ....

when this world was made it was filled with bouth good and bad...if "god was only good why would he create bad?

i personal;y dont know...unless it is a way for us to grow?we must expeerance both in this life
where do we go when we die ?
who knows....
mabe we keep coming back till we get it right ?

mabey we start out in hell...and keep comeing back here till we get it right?and then we are alowed to pass from this world to the next...


maby not everything in all these religins is roung...perhaps we just cant see the whole picture?


keep on questgening everything arround you ...but when you find truth hold onto it...

my personal expeerances tell me i have to believe in something more than myself....but the preists of this world are just people like ourselves and dont have any knowleage not available to me
you dont need religin to find truth

religin is man made....
but the spirit of life is in us all

questgen religin
believe what is inside your self

[XPiperX]

Byyyyy the way... I could like to make clear in no uncertain terms, that I am not an athiest. I am agnostic.

[dirtydingusus]

Originally Posted by XPiperX

Byyyyy the way... I could like to make clear in no uncertain terms, that I am not an athiest. I am agnostic.

never been clear on what exactical agnostic is?

altho ive been told i fall into that cattigory better than the rest...still i will continue to check the little box that says "other" when asked my religin

[HighGrowMan]

Originally Posted by dirtydingusus

as usual i think confusing religin with spirituality is the first mistake people make ...over and over ...how many people are turned away from the truth by religin?

just becouse "they"claim not to be athiest are becoming more and more a religin....they believe ...sorry if i hurt your feelings just the way i see it...


no god who loves us would want us to suffer in hell...duh...

we just dont know the whole story...how could we?

i think religin is a carfully planed out tool to keep people from the truth ...if you are held by the constrants of religin of any kind you are cutting your self off from the larger truth

who is to say we are not in hell right now?running blinly arround trying to find a way out?

no one is even cappable of being perfect....no one...

so we are all doomed....

unless we begin to realize for there to be a "god"(for lack of a better term)he or she cannot posable be all"good" in order for good to be real he must be made of everything ...good and bad...

for there to be two sides is redickuless..


there is only peace where there is balance....and we cannot even begin to apprecate good with out bad to compair it to ...


just like the little rich boy who does not apprecate his expensive toys becouse he never went without ....

when this world was made it was filled with bouth good and bad...if "god was only good why would he create bad?

i personal;y dont know...unless it is a way for us to grow?we must expeerance both in this life
where do we go when we die ?
who knows....
mabe we keep coming back till we get it right ?

mabey we start out in hell...and keep comeing back here till we get it right?and then we are alowed to pass from this world to the next...


maby not everything in all these religins is roung...perhaps we just cant see the whole picture?


keep on questgening everything arround you ...but when you find truth hold onto it...

my personal expeerances tell me i have to believe in something more than myself....but the preists of this world are just people like ourselves and dont have any knowleage not available to me
you dont need religin to find truth

religin is man made....
but the spirit of life is in us all

questgen religin
believe what is inside your self

+rep. Awsome post

[AK Infinity]

[AK puts his finger up to test the winds of futility.]

Yup, the conditions seem fairly good for a dialogue that won't get anywhere, but still why should I let a downpour tell me it's raining?

"Debate is masculine, conversation is feminine."

~Amos Bronson Alcott~

[Puts his hip waders on and breaks out an umbrella, "Yeah, it'll be different this time. After another frothy debate, we'll all come together in respect and love. We're stoners, and stoners don't hold grudges." Soon the sky blackened and down it came. "My God it's raining ****!"]

[weedseed]

Originally Posted by junkiedays

God: "Oh, let's see here Bob, you donated millions of dollars to charity I see? Fed some third world countries... Built some schools, Big Brother program, fed the homeless... Damn, this is a nice resume. Oh, wait, we have a problem here. I see you aren't a religious person. You don't believe in me, Bob? To Hell with you!"

If that's your God, he's a jackass.

"Bob: God i dont believe in you at all and care nothing about what you want from me or for me but i did all of these things so id say i deserve to go to your heaven if it does indeed exist....PS: did i mention i want nothing to do with you?"

if this is your idea of fair id say God isnt the jackass here....itd be "bob"


edit: and to dirtydingusus...its true..its not in Gods will that any should perish (eternally) which is exactly why He gives you the choice of heaven or hell...if you choose heaven then He is overwhelmed with joy...if you choose hell (denying his existence and his plan) then He weeps oceans for your lost soul...

this is an answer from a christian view..

[cheebaa]

Originally Posted by weedseed

"Bob: God i dont believe in you at all and care nothing about what you want from me or for me but i did all of these things so id say i deserve to go to your heaven if it does indeed exist....PS: did i mention i want nothing to do with you?"

if this is your idea of fair id say God isnt the jackass here....

Now thats putting words in peoples mouths.

I agree with junkiedays statement, and its not that I want nothing to do with god, its the fact HE has given me very little evidence to believe in him.

[weedseed]

Originally Posted by cheebaa

Now thats putting words in peoples mouths.

I agree with junkiedays statement, and its not that I want nothing to do with god, its the fact HE has given me very little evidence to believe in him.

thats not putting words in anyone's mouth. if you wanted anything to do with God youd look for Him...im only stating the obvious

the evidence is in the experience..

honestly many christians (very sadly true) havent had a supernatural experience with God..only because they dont truly give their all..

and if you say its inaccurate to say someone who doesnt believe in God wants nothing to do with Him then i challenge you to give Him your heart ...seek Him diligently and with fervency...if you do that you will have your proof...

if you cant/wont do that then i was right in saying what i said.