ConFuddled AbOut ReLigiOn

[SuPPeR]

Ok just poured through the spirituality forum,
And i have a few little things to add.
Firstly i dont believe religion or god.
The idea of this is absurd to me, to the point where i find organised religion to be incredibly humourous.
I think the bible in whatever form was written to control the masses, and for profit.

As a loose guideline it contains the basic elements to live a happy life.
Dont steal,lie,kill etc. So this isnt a stab at the religiously inclined.
Just wanted a little peek from your side of the fence.

I worry about the sanity of people who blindly follow the invisible big brother theory.
And even more so, those that pass this 'knowledge' onto other people and even their own children. My parents left me free to choose my own path in life.
You are lucky if you have 85 years on this planet, and as human you are restricted to what you can do with this time.
Various factors including Infancy,Currency,Health,Accidents,Children etc all eat away at this time.(Including time spent worshipping your chosen deity)
Surely the time spent doing church activities could be better spent?

I guess the question i want answered is How do you ignore the giant holes in your religions?
Are you just naturally not curious, or terrified of Hell?
Or is this one of those greater good things, that you going to tell me i dont understand.
Either way if a religiously minded person could reply i would be most grateful.
Cheers.

Ps. If anyone knows when roughly it was that man stopped viewing itself as an animal,
and attempting to evolve.Would be great........

[Zylark]

Nice post dude.

As for your questions, I can't answer them from a believers point of view. Not inclined to superstition myself. But I think I know the answer to at least one, the one regarding the holes in religion.

Simple really, they ignore them at best (or just don't know any better, being fed misinformation all their lives.). At worst they are aware of them, but rationalize them away in a mental gymnastic known as apologetics. Which by the way is another word for conceding that their religion do not make any sense whatsoever.

edit: Ahhh, from Sunny Scotland I see. I'll take a stab at that being just about as much an exaggeration as Playa de West Norway

[SuPPeR]

So effectively brain washing.....sometimes even your own children.
Scary stuff.
Waiting on a religious person now ^^

As for the sunny....i think i seen the sun once, but i may have been wrong.

[the roach]

Religion (specifically christianity) uses fear of the unknown to scare people into supporting it. This intense fear of "hell" causes people to believe in a ridiculous idea, regardless of numerous loopholes because they desperately want to escape the unknown. And this fear tactic is sadly working.

http://forum.grasscity.com/spiritual...-not-real.html

Just dont be afraid, after all you could die today in a car crash.
Enjoy your life, and dont give in to the fear they try to set on you.

Originally Posted by SuPPeR

Waiting on a religious person now ^^

Well, you'll have to wait a bit longer for a bullshit response.

[SuPPeR]

Originally Posted by the roach

Well, you'll have to wait a bit longer for a bullshit response.

Eagerly awaiting

[Maitereya]

Eagerly awaiting

ill take a stab at it.

Firstly i dont believe religion or god.

i find it odd that people say they dont believe something and talk about it as a fact of existance. you obviously have a facination with god and religion if you are making threads about it.

I think the bible in whatever form was written to control the masses, and for profit.

for the most part. i suggest you check out other religions sacred texts, some dont say anything about controling the masses and they were passed down by word of mouth for centuries.

As a loose guideline it contains the basic elements to live a happy life.
Dont steal,lie,kill etc. So this isnt a stab at the religiously inclined.
Just wanted a little peek from your side of the fence.

the bible really tries to set the guidelines, 10 commandments and such. i prefer sacred texts which suggest how to be closer with oneself and the universal life force. i think thats the most fundamental understanding for the religious, but some religions(christian) largely ignore that. the bible does have some connectedness with the universal, but its largely cloaked in parables and other stories (god, satan) then it tends to get misconstrewed.

Surely the time spent doing church activities could be better spent?

same could be said for playing world of warcraft or smoking weed, its all perspective. it would be nice if people would just get together and love one another and have fun for free.

I guess the question i want answered is How do you ignore the giant holes in your religions?

personally im able to recognize those holes and see religion for what its for, but of course there are different people on the planet who have different views.

Ps. If anyone knows when roughly it was that man stopped viewing itself as an animal,
and attempting to evolve.Would be great........

about 10,000 years ago after he ate a psychedelic mushroom. theory of course

[geologyrox]

Originally Posted by SuPPeR

Ps. If anyone knows when roughly it was that man stopped viewing itself as an animal,and attempting to evolve.Would be great........

I don't know about pinning a time on when we started 'attempting' to evolve... I think it's better seen as we have always been 'attempting' to evolve, we have only just very recently (past 200 years ish) realized that the biological tendency to reproduce certain traits is part of a grander 'evolution' process. Before that, we saw it as the 'preservation of blood lines' and the furthering of ones people.

Previously even to that, there must have been some point when man 'stopped viewing itself as an animal' and moved from food-fuck-sleep to food-fuck-sleep-dream, with dreams of a more distant future instead of the past. I think the Torah tells (at it's root) a good tale about these early humans, who ate the fruit of the 'Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil,' but not that of the tree of life. Immortality is not for us to have, but we have the divine fruit of Knowledge, of being able to know right and wrong. The responsibility that knowledge sets upon us is what the story is about, and that's a cool concept with or without God.

[SuPPeR]

Originally Posted by Maitereya

i find it odd that people say they dont believe something and talk about it as a fact of existance. you obviously have a facination with god and religion if you are making threads about it.

There is nothing more fascinating than the biggest killer of people in history.
Unfortunately religion is a constant in todays society,
As long as people are weak minded enough to still need a security blanket.

for the most part. i suggest you check out other religions sacred texts, some dont say anything about controling the masses and they were passed down by word of mouth for centuries.

Well thats the catch isn't it,
Of course they arent going to write about controlling the masses....
Ever so slightly counter productive eh?
Passed down by word of mouth for centuries....Your making this too easy.
CHINESE WHISPERS.
And as for checking out other religious doctrines....quiz me!

the bible really tries to set the guidelines, 10 commandments and such. i prefer sacred texts which suggest how to be closer with oneself and the universal life force. i think thats the most fundamental understanding for the religious, but some religions(christian) largely ignore that. the bible does have some connectedness with the universal, but its largely cloaked in parables and other stories (god, satan) then it tends to get misconstrewed.

Ok sort of agreed with me here.
But you moved into buddism and zen.

same could be said for playing world of warcraft or smoking weed, its all perspective. it would be nice if people would just get together and love one another and have fun for free.

I was intending the statement to mean doing things you find enjoyable.
I know quite a lot of people who attend church and hate it.Surely that time could be used to gain fufillment in other areas of our all too short lifespan.
For those who enjoy church, Your already too far gone.

personally im able to recognize those holes and see religion for what its for, but of course there are different people on the planet who have different views.

Yet no mention of what you see it for?
Heaven and Hell, Good and Bad, Light and Dark.
All religious doctrines are cleverly crafted masterpieces.
Not accurate but certainly creative and powerful over those without sense.

Maitereya what exactly is your stance?

[flower_child]

I didn't really read through too much of this thread, but I will put in my recent convert to agnosticism (I don't like being an "ism", but oh well".) 2 cents.

Cent one: Many believers are fed their beliefs from the day they're born, (myself included) so it becomes concrete in their minds.

Cent two: I like to think of religion as not intended for "controlling the masses."
I'll be the first to admit that it has been, is, and always will be misused for that purpose, but I think that religion does serve as a good guidline for how to live your life as long as you don't get carried away, and that if it truly works for someone that doesn't try to push it on others and that honestly does find meaning and personal fulfillment in it, then there's nothing bad at all about it.

That being said, many people just get too carried away with it.

[the roach]

I find that religion coincides with people's financial well being far too often.

Coincidence?

No.

[Maitereya]

I find that religion coincides with people's financial well being far too often.

Coincidence?

No.

my friend once told me jesus said people had to pay 5% of their income to the church and i fliped out.

Maitereya what exactly is your stance?

im not a fan of religion because it can be intepreted wrongly and too often does. but i also think its a good stepping stone for people that want to understand universal truths. after a while people stop needing to use religous texts because they are just words that convey an idea. its somewhere in there they get caught on the idea of going to heaven/hell or reincarnation. people accept it as a fact and then they are stuck in a twisted game.

as for religion as an organization... im completely against it. it divides people and starts wars. truth is about coming together and loving one another.

[ganjalover17]

Religion was definitely not created in order to control people and for profit. Religion was created a long time ago because humans couldn't control/understand what was going on around the world (disease, death, hurricanes, tornadoes, etc.). First they tried to explain it and change things around them with magic, but when that didn't work people turned to religion. Pretty much myths were created in order to explain the things that were going on. When people looked for a valid, on paper explanation, they turned to science. For some people its much easier to believe in religion than science, but for others its hard to get the thought of God into our heads. <---- yes i'm an athiest... I think religion is a great thing and i wish i could believe in God so you could have someone to turn to when your in search for answers but i simply can't lie to myself. I think religion is great if its not totally out control and only applied as a simple guide to life your life if your lost. YEAh so thats all i gotta say

[the roach]

Originally Posted by ganjalover17

Religion was definitely not created in order to control people and for profit.

hundreds of religions have been created for the sole purpose of personal monetary gain or control.

[SuPPeR]

Ganjalover you just wrote a pile of hypocritical nonsense.
Research a little eh?

[Mr.GoodStuff]

You wonder the sanity in believers? I wonder how objective and rational your thought process can be saying things like that.

Well I for one think it's a normal thing to believe in God, whether it be yourself or some deity. I also think it's normal to not believe in God.

I don't think either side is any less rational than the other until they start pressing their beliefs on others... Although there is a fine line between expression and pressing the belief.

Feelings are not rational, and it isn't very rational to act like everything in the world should be.

That's just how I feel.