What If We're Stronger than God?

[bluewoods]

What if God was just lonely and created man hoping to have someone to talk to?
The question would remain: are we there yet?

[Rasta_Man]

Originally Posted by bluewoods

What if God was just lonely and created man hoping to have someone to talk to?
The question would remain: are we there yet?

I don't know, but the miraculous lack of a divine being is a strong indicator.

[bluewoods]

Originally Posted by Rasta_Man

I don't know, but the miraculous lack of a divine being is a strong indicator.

I think it will take a lot of teamwork.

[Mr.GoodStuff]

Quote: Cannabis
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by Mr.GoodStuff
To measure power there must be absolutes. Chance is only a slave to possibility. There is no chance without the possibility already existing.
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Yes but there can be a fine line between possible and impossible. Chance is an unknown and unpredictable element in happenings that seems to have no assignable cause.

Chance is not a happening of the unknown. Chance is a realization of possibility. For chance to exist, all the possibilities for what that becomes must exist. You could at least draw the conclusion that that specific occurance was a possibility that became reality.

There is no line between possible and impossible unless we define it and have absolutes. We are calling all the shots, and we don't realize because we don't want to spoil our own show.

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We are made up of the same exact energy that everything else is.
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proof?

Everything is made up of protons and neutrons or a transferance of vibration (radiation) to other protons and neutrons. A logical leap, I know- but it sure does look like all things are connected in this way; from what I have observed from physics and the pioneers of the subject.

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by Mr.GoodStuff
We are not seperate from God, we only believe we are. It's just God hiding from the fact he is alone and his power is nothing without anyone to witness it. In fact, HE is nothing without us. He is a lot like zero. Infinite, yet nobody can measure it.

God a pushover? God is a very lonely and bored energy field that we are a part of. He could be a pushover if you wanted, but he can also be the most insane amount of power you could fathom. His nature formed duality in order to make a distinction in all possibilities. A being that is all encompassing is alone, a being that is all possibilities is not a specific thing. No way to experience chance without a seperation of possibilities. This spawned the creation of time, in order to once again see a separation- from one event to the next.
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we have very different views on what God is.

That is exactly what God wants. He doesn't want everyone to have the same view because that's not who he is. He isn't one specific thing, he is all things including you. You are unique, so God is unique. If you believe in the Bible, in the beginning, there was nothing. But there was God.

With that said, who or what could God make you out of?

How do you think God is different than all-encompassing, all-powerful, and all-knowing- and why with those qualities, he didn't have a serious dilema involving entertainment and acknowledgement that he solved with everything you can currently see and experience?

Isn't that exactly what God did in the Bible?

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by Mr.GoodStuff
Whether you want to feel he created the world or just simply IS the world, there is an energy that is all-encompassing. It's the reason for the relativity, you witness the same laws of physics everywhere in the universe because it's all the same energy field.
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relativity is a theory, how do we know what exists everywhere in the universe? the answer is we don't, and most likely never will.

We take the theory into a lot of mathmatical equations right now. Not to mention the atomic bomb being a shining example of the theory's potential. We haven't studied the entire universe because we haven't reached out that far yet- but the planet Earth is displaying a direct corrilation between matter and energy. Perhaps I'm not connected to anything else but the Earth, but I know something is trying to reveal itself without totally breaking your heart in the process.

It's trying to tell us the miracle of the creation, from a being that is so lucky it happened. We are keeping a secret from ourselves- of course it's going to be hard to get around and you won't if you never try. But it is the most beautiful thing I have ever understood: we are the very purpose and will of God, experiencing at all times the most glorious masterpiece of a story that he could come up with. You open up your eyes and see only what you want to see. Whether you look at it negatively or not, that is your will and your emotions are your own. You are in control of your own destiny because there is no one else but God. There is nothing else but the all-encompassing.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by Mr.GoodStuff
Ah, well the God of Abraham is wicked powerful- minus that rest on the 7th day thing. Must have been beat from all the creation, running low on all-power I guess. Needed kick back and relax for 24 hours LOL .
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The Bible doesn't say the 'day' its referring to is 24 hours.

I love the Bible and have read it many times. There isn't anywhere it says that. I was being sarcastic, trying to lighten the mood. To think of an all-powerful being taking a break at all is just funny to me. I don't think God took a break- maybe to sleep LOL but that was just from being in the story everyone was a part of, he still dreamt. Things keep unfolding before his eyes no matter what he does it seems.

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The humanistic or kingly traits that the Bible shows about God is a sign of it being written by people for people and not by God for people in my opinion..
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I agree completely.



Quote:
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Definitely an interesting question though- because the God of Abraham always had trouble controlling us..
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how so?

The flood. Jesus being nailed up on a cross. Right now people are wicked and evil running amok LOL amok so stoned "LET MY PEOPLE GO" ... couldn't he just snap his fingers or say it in the way that brought for the light??? Did he really need somebody to help him out along the way?

I feel it is a metaphor. God needed us, and God became us. That's why he needed to rest, couldn't control others, and needed to team up to get bigger tasks accomplished. He divided his power in order to feel true love of another that was completely unique from himself from what I understand.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by Mr.GoodStuff
I drew the conclusion that he DIDN'T want to control us at all- rather watch us and wait to see what we did. That way, no matter what happens he is in control (wanting to experience a chance situation and witness freedom of expression) and all-power stands true.
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In my opinion, that can be a very valid conclusion.

I understand that people aren't going to be able to all agree as long as we are unique and want to stay that way. I don't think anybody is wrong- in fact I believe they are only cutting themselves off from the knowledge for their own entertainment. One cannot learn or experience when he is all knowing and all powerful.

I feel that what people believe about life is a holy thing that shouldn't be forced on anyone. All I do is stand by what I see and if others see it that way, great- if they don't I want to hear how they see it. I know I have something to learn from each and every person I meet.

[cannabis]

Originally Posted by Mr.GoodStuff

Chance is not a happening of the unknown. Chance is a realization of possibility. For chance to exist, all the possibilities for what that becomes must exist. You could at least draw the conclusion that that specific occurance was a possibility that became reality..

Basically what i said in my post was from a dictionary and put into my own words so your argument can't be legitimate.

There is no line between possible and impossible unless we define it and have absolutes. We are calling all the shots, and we don't realize because we don't want to spoil our own show.

If we were calling the shots we wouldn't be posing questions like the ones in this thread.

Everything is made up of protons and neutrons or a transferance of vibration (radiation) to other protons and neutrons. A logical leap, I know- but it sure does look like all things are connected in this way; from what I have observed from physics and the pioneers of the subject.

How do you become a pioneer of a subject that is very much unknown? we understand things to our knowledge, but just exactly how knowledgeable are we?

That is exactly what God wants. He doesn't want everyone to have the same view because that's not who he is. He isn't one specific thing, he is all things including you. You are unique, so God is unique. If you believe in the Bible, in the beginning, there was nothing. But there was God.

you don't know the intentions of God, no one does.
And humans aren't all that unique, we our products of a greater power, God is completely unique because God is immortal.

With that said, who or what could God make you out of?

That's something I can't answer, I would have to have a greater knowledge of our purpose to answer that.

How do you think God is different than all-encompassing, all-powerful, and all-knowing- and why with those qualities, he didn't have a serious dilema involving entertainment and acknowledgement that he solved with everything you can currently see and experience?

Isn't that exactly what God did in the Bible?

What exactly are you asking?

We take the theory into a lot of mathmatical equations right now. Not to mention the atomic bomb being a shining example of the theory's potential. We haven't studied the entire universe because we haven't reached out that far yet- but the planet Earth is displaying a direct corrilation between matter and energy. Perhaps I'm not connected to anything else but the Earth, but I know something is trying to reveal itself without totally breaking your heart in the process.

Yes and because we haven't studied outside of our own capabilities, it's irrelevant to make assumptions about the unknown. What exactly do mathematical equations prove? If you think about it numbers are just symbols, sure they can be exact but when a number is unimaginable it only stands as a symbol to give us an idea of. When the brain can't wrap around the measure of a number how logical can it be?
I'm not trying to completely shoot you down here, i hope you understand what I'm getting at.

It's trying to tell us the miracle of the creation, from a being that is so lucky it happened. We are keeping a secret from ourselves- of course it's going to be hard to get around and you won't if you never try. But it is the most beautiful thing I have ever understood: we are the very purpose and will of God, experiencing at all times the most glorious masterpiece of a story that he could come up with. You open up your eyes and see only what you want to see. Whether you look at it negatively or not, that is your will and your emotions are your own. You are in control of your own destiny because there is no one else but God. There is nothing else but the all-encompassing.

I'm a little confused, I understand what you mean but maybe you can elaborate on that.

I love the Bible and have read it many times. There isn't anywhere it says that. I was being sarcastic, trying to lighten the mood. To think of an all-powerful being taking a break at all is just funny to me. I don't think God took a break- maybe to sleep LOL but that was just from being in the story everyone was a part of, he still dreamt. Things keep unfolding before his eyes no matter what he does it seems.

ok i misunderstood, and agree the mood of this thread should be lightened, there's nothing wrong with friendly debating. And as far as your question, I pose this to you, suppose God didn't need a break but chose to take one. Just because he's an all powerful being doesn't mean God doesn't have free will.

The flood. Jesus being nailed up on a cross. Right now people are wicked and evil running amok LOL amok so stoned "LET MY PEOPLE GO" ... couldn't he just snap his fingers or say it in the way that brought for the light??? Did he really need somebody to help him out along the way?

We don't know if God did need help, God chooses not to interfere with free will it doesn't mean he can't.

I feel it is a metaphor. God needed us, and God became us. That's why he needed to rest, couldn't control others, and needed to team up to get bigger tasks accomplished. He divided his power in order to feel true love of another that was completely unique from himself from what I understand.

This goes with what i kinda just said, again there's no evidence suggesting god needed help, for all we know he could accomplish anything with a snap and chose not to oppose free will.




Our views are similar, I hope you can understand my points. because i understand where you're coming from. And it's nice to dispute with someone who has also actually read the Bible and isn't just pulling stuff from their ass.

[dbpwattack]

we are all part of God

[Uplifted]

I totally agree with this "what if" question. But that's just it, a "what if" question. No biblical God = No possibility of this "what if" question.

Still though, very entertaining.



Betcha you could piss off some religious nuts with your question...

[Rasta_Man]

Originally Posted by Uplifted

Betcha you could piss off some religious nuts with your question...

You have no idea

[Mr.GoodStuff]

Originally Posted by cannabis

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Chance is not a happening of the unknown. Chance is a realization of possibility. For chance to exist, all the possibilities for what that becomes must exist. You could at least draw the conclusion that that specific occurance was a possibility that became reality..
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Basically what i said in my post was from a dictionary and put into my own words so your argument can't be legitimate.

OK I just tried to reply to all of this and totally dropped the page when I was almost done replying... So I guess I have to start all over. Had some really good writing on it too.

That definition of chance is not the only definition. It involves not knowing the parameters. Chance can only be because of possibilities.

A good way to look at it would be dice: you dictate the possible outcomes from the number of sides, choose how hard to throw them, and if you bounce them off a wall or not.

I try to keep my arguments legitiment to avoid wasting everybody's time.

Chance is not always something that comes from not knowing the parameters or cause then. Dice are the perfect example of what I'm saying.

If you had a seperate computer to do all the calculations and create the dice randomly and throw them randomly- you could certainly predict possible outcomes.

That definition of chance requires there to be no reason for the possibilities existing. From someone who doesn't believe in the Creator that makes sense, but to me- it's plain as day that God is the reason.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">There is no line between possible and impossible unless we define it and have absolutes. We are calling all the shots, and we don't realize because we don't want to spoil our own show. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
If we were calling the shots we wouldn't be posing questions like the ones in this thread.

Not if we wanted to feel like we weren't. I was saying we are calling all the shots and don't realize it.

Is it any wonder then why we would be questioning? If we wanted to feel this way?

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Everything is made up of protons and neutrons or a transferance of vibration (radiation) to other protons and neutrons. A logical leap, I know- but it sure does look like all things are connected in this way; from what I have observed from physics and the pioneers of the subject. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
How do you become a pioneer of a subject that is very much unknown? we understand things to our knowledge, but just exactly how knowledgeable are we?

The truth is, we are just some dumb monkeys. We only believe what we can see.

When everyone sees it differently, then it looks like what we believe in isn't fact. But the thing is, it's just a different perspective on the same thing. When people realize it things will change drastically world-wide.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">That is exactly what God wants. He doesn't want everyone to have the same view because that's not who he is. He isn't one specific thing, he is all things including you. You are unique, so God is unique. If you believe in the Bible, in the beginning, there was nothing. But there was God. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
you don't know the intentions of God, no one does.
And humans aren't all that unique, we our products of a greater power, God is completely unique because God is immortal.

Yes we do know the intentions of God. God makes no mistakes, so that everything you see, feel, do, think, or know is the will of God. He is the power behind everything, so that you open up your eyes and see only what you want to see. In the Matrix they said "wake up in your bed and believe only what you want to believe"

Everything is the will and purpose of God. Or it wouldn't be- even things that displease God. The intentions of God are anything you have ever experienced.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">With that said, who or what could God make you out of? </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
That's something I can't answer, I would have to have a greater knowledge of our purpose to answer that.

The whole reason I feel God is alone is because of the very first verse in the Bible- "In the Beginning there was nothing. But there was God"

There wasn't anything but Him- absolutely nothing. So God made you out of the only thing he had: Himself. The Bible does not speak of anything else or any other.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">How do you think God is different than all-encompassing, all-powerful, and all-knowing- and why with those qualities, he didn't have a serious dilema involving entertainment and acknowledgement that he solved with everything you can currently see and experience?

Isn't that exactly what God did in the Bible? </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
What exactly are you asking?

You were saying our views on God differed. I think I know where the confusion came from though- I am talking about the All here; and you are talking about the Father. The Father is the Creator, the God of love and understanding. The Christian God.

The Father is a part of the All and has much different things about Him. He isn't just possibility- he is undying love and devotion. He can do nothing but love and give. He isn't alone because he has creation.

But the thing is... There is no Father without the All. I see the All as the Big Bang and the Father as the God of Abraham.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">We take the theory into a lot of mathmatical equations right now. Not to mention the atomic bomb being a shining example of the theory's potential. We haven't studied the entire universe because we haven't reached out that far yet- but the planet Earth is displaying a direct corrilation between matter and energy. Perhaps I'm not connected to anything else but the Earth, but I know something is trying to reveal itself without totally breaking your heart in the process. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Yes and because we haven't studied outside of our own capabilities, it's irrelevant to make assumptions about the unknown. What exactly do mathematical equations prove? If you think about it numbers are just symbols, sure they can be exact but when a number is unimaginable it only stands as a symbol to give us an idea of. When the brain can't wrap around the measure of a number how logical can it be?
I'm not trying to completely shoot you down here, i hope you understand what I'm getting at.

I wouldn't say irrelevant more than very frustrating. I really feel these things are important, even though yes- they shouldn't matter at times.

It is my purpose to share the wonder and beauty of our existance. The surface is great but what makes that possible has interested me more lately; even if there is nothing to go on but some crazy vision and an understanding of physics.

I totally understand where you are coming from. The only reason I share these things is because I experienced it and want others to as well. I am coming to terms with having to paint a picture instead of explain it.

It's a lot like a metaphor- people can interpret it any way they want. They could see the same thing but in a different light.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">It's trying to tell us the miracle of the creation, from a being that is so lucky it happened. We are keeping a secret from ourselves- of course it's going to be hard to get around and you won't if you never try. But it is the most beautiful thing I have ever understood: we are the very purpose and will of God, experiencing at all times the most glorious masterpiece of a story that he could come up with. You open up your eyes and see only what you want to see. Whether you look at it negatively or not, that is your will and your emotions are your own. You are in control of your own destiny because there is no one else but God. There is nothing else but the all-encompassing. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
I'm a little confused, I understand what you mean but maybe you can elaborate on that.

I'll try: This is the Greatest Story Ever Told. We are experiencing a miracle at all times and don't even realize it.

We are part of the greatest accomplishment of all time.

That's all I'm trying to say.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">I love the Bible and have read it many times. There isn't anywhere it says that. I was being sarcastic, trying to lighten the mood. To think of an all-powerful being taking a break at all is just funny to me. I don't think God took a break- maybe to sleep LOL but that was just from being in the story everyone was a part of, he still dreamt. Things keep unfolding before his eyes no matter what he does it seems. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
ok i misunderstood, and agree the mood of this thread should be lightened, there's nothing wrong with friendly debating. And as far as your question, I pose this to you, suppose God didn't need a break but chose to take one. Just because he's an all powerful being doesn't mean God doesn't have free will.

Even the thought of an all-powerful being wanting to take a break is funny to me. For him to need a break, he must first become tired.

That's what I feel is the reason for us: If God wanted to give something away, part of him would have to be lacking.

For him to want to rest; he must become weak. For him to want to learn; he must become wanting.

God definitely has free-will and sometimes he has to sacrifice his power to realize some of his demands. I agree he could want to take a break, yes.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">The flood. Jesus being nailed up on a cross. Right now people are wicked and evil running amok LOL amok so stoned "LET MY PEOPLE GO" ... couldn't he just snap his fingers or say it in the way that brought for the light??? Did he really need somebody to help him out along the way? </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
We don't know if God did need help, God chooses not to interfere with free will it doesn't mean he can't.

When it looks like he "can't" it's only because he doesn't want to. I'm saying that the way they put it looked like he needed us to carry out his bidding. That's why I believe it to be a metaphor. He wouldn't have flooded the world if free-will was so important to him. Those people weren't free to do as they pleased once the water got neck deep. Loopholes spell human error. That means metaphor to me if there is any truth to be found.

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">I feel it is a metaphor. God needed us, and God became us. That's why he needed to rest, couldn't control others, and needed to team up to get bigger tasks accomplished. He divided his power in order to feel true love of another that was completely unique from himself from what I understand. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
This goes with what i kinda just said, again there's no evidence suggesting god needed help, for all we know he could accomplish anything with a snap and chose not to oppose free will.

In the Bible God asked for help a lot. He even made a lot of demands that took away the free-will of his people. Samson is a good example. God told him not to cut his hair and he would be incredibly strong as long as his hair never was cut. Is that free-will, or him dangling a carrot of power infront of Samson?

Making the Bible into a metaphor doesn't make the Bible any less amazing. It makes it more believable.

Our views are similar, I hope you can understand my points. because i understand where you're coming from. And it's nice to dispute with someone who has also actually read the Bible and isn't just pulling stuff from their ass.

I can definitely understand where you are coming from bro. I love the Bible very much and God is always close to me. I am always trying to share the love of God with the world because it means so much to me. Thank you for making this possible <!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

[Smigs]

We couldn't be stronger than God. God created us, we do not have the power to create just multiply. It would take someone a lot stronger than us to create all this.