to be beckoned and to follow

[phiegnux]

mysticism, or, more precisly, a "spiritual experience" brought on by a psychedelic, a universal realization, an apparition of sorts, or any other source holds validity, i think, solely on the decision of the one experiencing it. at times it may seem, or feel, that if it is believed to be so (valid, that is) when it is not, certain thought processes or decisions dictated by such will ultimately seem, or be, pointless. the opposite (treating an experience as insignificant when it is) along with being easier to determine its legitmacy, may hold dire consequences in the end.

these thoghts were birthed after long contemplation of my first, albiet quite short, psychedelic experience. i hit a tiny pinch of salvia divinorum (i think 15x) in a pitch-black room and soon felt the infamous gravity pull, and also a sensation of being on a ferris wheel or merry-go-round, which apparently is also quite common. after all this, i got apprehensive of going further. as i tried to grab "reality", i was given the sensation that i was being told something. it was almost a friendly warning, one that harbored no ill will (that sounds somewhat contradictory, though to me its more paradoxical). over all, it was a beckoning, and i, while slowly slipping out of the experience, was told by god knows "its all right, keep going!" of course, it was inaudible, but i reacted to it as if it were the loudest phrase ive ever heard; my eyes bugged out as a sign or shock or awe. after that, i think i became almost frightened, by my own will, though, for the message was very warm.

(id like to add this is the only psychedelic widely regarded as such that ive ever usded)

i cannot explain the intesity or would-be profundity of the experience.* i curse myself now for not going further. i so wish i had let go. i think very intently (i would say "i believe" but im so careful and even apprehensive to say what i believe it, im sure others have felt the same) that i gave up a prime opportunity to delve into my unconscious and even communicate further with the entity who spoke to me and possibly view its realm. the only thing i can think of to reach that dimension again is to LET GO the next time around, that is the next time i try salvia, or maybe a few liberty caps or LSD-25. all i know is i want to correct the mistake i made.

it felt so significant, so earth-shattering, so profound (along with enticing and somewhat mind-boggling) i can only assume it was ligit. so maybe thats what it comes down to; the sheer feeling of an experience based on the intuition of the individual. which also makes me think that its somewhat impossible for members of a certain faith to share in the same spirituality as another member.

anywho. DISCUSS. and please, please share your thoughts on what ive said about my experience. also, share your own, provided it is somewhat [i dont want to say similar, but] along the same lines, and i, along with other blades, will share our own thoughts.

weeeeeeeeeeeeee!

*i said would-be because, like i said, i cut it short.

[skywalker]

I'm not sure if I know exactly what you trying to say, but I'm going to go ahead anyway, and you can correct me where necessary.

Originally Posted by phiegnux

mysticism, or, more precisly, a "spiritual experience" brought on by a psychedelic, a universal realization, an apparition of sorts, or any other source holds validity, i think, solely on the decision of the one experiencing it.

I hesitate to agree with that. I'm sure all of us learnt the hard way that this rule doesn't apply to the law of gravity. Why should it apply to any other universal constant? If nothing is happening, nothing is happening. Why should your decision to believe affect whats going on in the universe? Consciousness is an amazing experience, but I think people greatly overestimate it and give it credit where none is due. To me, our mind is simply a tool we use to be aware of our environment. I dont thinks its workings can extend outside the head, whether we believe this or not. IMHO.

Originally Posted by phiegnux

at times it may seem, or feel, that if it is believed to be so (valid, that is) when it is not, certain thought processes or decisions dictated by such will ultimately seem, or be, pointless. the opposite (treating an experience as insignificant when it is) along with being easier to determine its legitmacy, may hold dire consequences in the end.

It's true that if it actually is valid and we treat it insignificantly, the consequences may very well be dire. However, I really believe this is not the case(and I know the world disagrees with me) and nothing external really is happening. Compare it to the phenomenon of dreaming - people have believed it to be very mystical due to the inexplicable nature of its source and the autonomous processes going on while the person in the dream feels very passive. This creates the effect of separating the person dreaming from whatever is generating the dream experience. The logical conclusion for anyone without enough scientific information would be to assume that they left their bodies to a new world during sleep, or some being projected the dream into their mind. But we know this is not true. Dreams are the paintings of the mind on the canvas of our consciousness, from the palette of our experiences. For instance you cannot dream about a sense you have not experienced. There is no reason why a being with the ability to manipulate your consciousness should be limited to using your experiences.

But as for the the psychedelic experience, I can only extrapolate from the mind-altered state of dreaming, and conclude that its just like having a dream while you're awake; having your consciousness painted over while you watch, eyes wide open. Moving further, I believe our palette of experience not only contains sights, sounds, smells and tastes.. but contains concepts, ideas, and feelings.. the kinds that don't have words associated to them yet. The feeling of heartbreak, frustration of being in rush hour, the many joys of love.. these experiences are stored in our memories, and some can't quite be described, but they are there. It thess psychedelic experiences that bring them to the surface and play with them in our minds.. and this, to me, is the sole cause of the mystical experience.

I'm not simply against mysticism.. I just hesitate to go anywhere that seems to contradict mainstream science. I'm fully aware that science can be wrong, but even you trust science with your life everyday you sit in a vehicle or eat anything that contains chemicals you can't even pronounce. If you can trust science with the little things, I can trust it with the large ones - for now, that is until we can be sure beyond a reasonable doubt that there are forces in the universe which interact and communicate with us. I have no problem dealing with the truth.. as long as I'm convinced it's the truth.

Well, you asked for my opinion...

*puts on his flogging pants*