droopy plants...not overwatering, i promise

[kaBLAM]

but i have no camera.

so...i have 15, 2 week old plants under 682 watts. (hps and cfl mix)

the plants are working on their fourth node.

they are in a generic potting soil comprised of composted humus, composted manure and peat moss. i've added perlite. the soil does not seem muddy or brick like. there were no added nutes.

this week i added 1/8 strength miracle grow all purpose plant food. i bought some tomato plant food too. i plan on using that from now on.

the average temp is about 86 degrees (hot, i know--stealth is an issue and we're trying to bring it down.) it does cool to about 70-72 in the night phase.

i do not know my humidity but it is a basement grow. the basement is finished and not "wet" as many basements can be. but it is definitely more moist down there than on the first floor.

i water once per week. i use the finger two inches down test. lol. if i'm unsure i wait another day.

i've tried looking this up but every time i type in drooping it comes up with overwatering. I KNOW this is not the case. is there another reason they could be drooping?

ph is between 6.3 and 6.8. it differs in the different pots. i'm not sure why.

thanks!

[Budzilla420]

Drooping leaves can be from underwatering too, and at once a week id say that might be it. Try giving them a good dose of water and see if they pick back up. In my experiance theyll spring back up in just half hour to an hour after getting water...

[kaBLAM]

i was wondering that myself. when i do water i water thoroughly and they never really seem to pick themselves back up. maybe they just need a couple of long drinks at a time.

of course i'm worried about overwatering them, though, lol. so i don't wanna over do it.

they are in 5 inch pots. btw. so they do get dry fairly quickly. but not THAT dry. know what i mean?

but perhaps the heat makes them need water sooner?

we are repotting into ten inches within the next two weeks, at which point we will start lst. not really relevant. just more details, like ppl 'round here enjoy.

[Headway420]

also check the weight of the pot after you generously water, then check it again in a couple days and see if it weighs about the same or a lot less.

[Budzilla420]

Id say with 5 inch pots you should be watering ever 2-3 days at least. Personally id rather have my plants have a little extra than not enough.

[kaBLAM]

bumping this up to report that this problem has still not rectified itself. i've repotted into 10 inch pots. the plants are still growing but are NOT spreading the leaves. they just droop downwards. i have stopped adding nutes. increased watering...but not too much.

at this point they are 4 weeks old.

i wish i had a damned camera.

so c'mon folks WHAT ELSE causes droopy leaves besides a watering issue? the ph is reading in the 6.2-6.6 range. there are 13 plants under 790 watts. planted in regular old unferted potting soil with a generous amount of perlite added. i have no mylar...just plywood painted flat white. fresh outside air coming in. average temp of 80 F. no exhaust really necessary because it's in a large unsealed room. nodes are TIGHTLY spaced. like, i have trouble lst'ing some of them.

i will answer any other questions to the best of my ability.

i HAVE tried researching this but if i type in droopy the results always come back with watering issues.

[ImTheJoker4u2]

Wilting can be caused by a copper deficiency, but thats rare.
Check this out >>>LINK<<<

[kellizar]

From what you have described, (and keep in mind I'm a new grower too) it seems like u have a combination of overwatering and underwatering.

I water my plants (3 wks old, 6" pots) a little bit every day, and they are green and vibrant. I think that you overwater when you do water them, and then underwater in the periods between.

When you water, does water pour out of the bottom of the pots? Or does a little bit just drip out? Also, how many days after you water does the top of the soil turn dry and crusty? That is when you should water.

[kaBLAM]

overwatering and underwatering??

that doesn't seem to make sense to me...although i'm a newbie...so what do i know.

anyway...when i "overwater" from a dry spell the plants never perk up. so it's not like they're fine for a day or so and then they get thirsty again.

i water until water just begins to run out of the bottom. the top of the soil dries within 1-2 days...but the inch or so below the surface stays wet for about 3-5 days...i've just changed to bigger pots (less than a week ago) so i'm not sure how long it's going to take for those pots to get dry as the plants, at four weeks old, are still pretty small.

the difference in how quickly the plants need to be watered seems directly contingent on where they are under the light. those directly under the hps dry out quickest. those at the perimeter of my grow which are being lit primarily by cfl, retain their water a bit longer.

i thought overwatering had to do with the frequency of watering...not the quantity. like, the soil and the plant can only hold so much water...so if you continue to water daily even when they are at max load then what you are really doing is drowning roots. THAT is the biggest problem with overwatering...it manifests itself in the leaves...but the problem is actually drowining roots. when i repotted my roots were white and healthy looking with no smell.

i raise aloe plants as well. aloes like the same soil conditions as MJ...so i feel like i know what i'm doing in this area. the plants have never wilted at the stalk from underwatering...this is what i've seen in many young plants in many pictures of MJ. My plants do not do this. the leaves, as they grow (because they are still growing...growth is fine) are droopy right from the outset. they stay that way, no matter how i'm watering. i check several times a day...they do not ever perk up.

here's my new hypothesis...my ph is shite. my ph meter sucks ass and there is some kind of nutelock going on. my lower fan leaves are yellowing...i thought it was just because they are the oldest leaves and the newest ones are growing in so quickly. but i am going to get some kind of new ph meter and test again. right now i am using a rapitest soil probe meter and a liquid bromythel blue ph testing solution. both give me ph in an acceptable range. but perhaps they're both wrong.

[kellizar]

Yeah I wasn't the clearest in my description. But from the information you just gave then I think you're underwatering. Ph problems could definitely be a factor also. But mj should be watered whenever it's almost dry about 3/4" down (1 knuckle). So from what you're saying you should be watering every 2 or 3 days at most.

[popcorn18]

Originally Posted by kaBLAM

overwatering and underwatering??

that doesn't seem to make sense to me...although i'm a newbie...so what do i know.

anyway...when i "overwater" from a dry spell the plants never perk up. so it's not like they're fine for a day or so and then they get thirsty again.

i water until water just begins to run out of the bottom. the top of the soil dries within 1-2 days...but the inch or so below the surface stays wet for about 3-5 days...i've just changed to bigger pots (less than a week ago) so i'm not sure how long it's going to take for those pots to get dry as the plants, at four weeks old, are still pretty small.

the difference in how quickly the plants need to be watered seems directly contingent on where they are under the light. those directly under the hps dry out quickest. those at the perimeter of my grow which are being lit primarily by cfl, retain their water a bit longer.

i thought overwatering had to do with the frequency of watering...not the quantity. like, the soil and the plant can only hold so much water...so if you continue to water daily even when they are at max load then what you are really doing is drowning roots. THAT is the biggest problem with overwatering...it manifests itself in the leaves...but the problem is actually drowining roots. when i repotted my roots were white and healthy looking with no smell.

i raise aloe plants as well. aloes like the same soil conditions as MJ...so i feel like i know what i'm doing in this area. the plants have never wilted at the stalk from underwatering...this is what i've seen in many young plants in many pictures of MJ. My plants do not do this. the leaves, as they grow (because they are still growing...growth is fine) are droopy right from the outset. they stay that way, no matter how i'm watering. i check several times a day...they do not ever perk up.

here's my new hypothesis...my ph is shite. my ph meter sucks ass and there is some kind of nutelock going on. my lower fan leaves are yellowing...i thought it was just because they are the oldest leaves and the newest ones are growing in so quickly. but i am going to get some kind of new ph meter and test again. right now i am using a rapitest soil probe meter and a liquid bromythel blue ph testing solution. both give me ph in an acceptable range. but perhaps they're both wrong.

It looks like a watering problem but i dont think thats what it is. maybe a N def.?

[StRdusT]

if it seems like a light green lime green on the plant with the droopyness id say nitrogen def. add some if this is the case as you said theres no nutes regular soil at week 4!!??!?!?!?!

[kaBLAM]

it WAS a ph problem

too alkaline. between 7 and 8. flushed, still watering once weekly with ph adjusted water down. perked right up. been foliar feeding to combat nutritional deficiencies as well, although i think with the next watering we'll just add nutes and stop foliar.

told you i promised it wasn't a watering problem.

[StRdusT]

technically it was. Ph should regularly be tested from the run off especially. different buildups alter the ph aswell

[kaBLAM]

Originally Posted by StRdusT

technically it was. Ph should regularly be tested from the run off especially. different buildups alter the ph aswell

ooookay...but what i was insisting was that it wasn't an overwatering/underwatering problem. which is what everyone was quick to label my problem. it wasn't an AMOUNT of watering problem.

i agree that water ended up being PART of the problem...but my water tests at 6.8. The REAL problem is that the soil I bought is VERY alkaline. Which I didn't know until I did some research on the individual components of the soil.

So sticking with my original watering schedule (1x per week) and adjusting the ph downwards to accommodate an alkaline soil (i'm using lemon juice to get it to 6.0 until I get some ph down)...and foliar feeding to combat the rootlock that occured at such a high ph...my plants are no longer droopy.