Babies are browning...

[DarthHerbage]

Light: 3 3/4th feet long, Full-spectrum 18000 lumen 234 watt T5 that I will be using for both veg and bloom

Smell: have one of the HTGsupply goblin charcoal filter/inline fan combo

Nutrients: goin with the Lucas Formula this time around, so GH Micro and Bloom
will also use Liquid Koolbloom, Superthrive, and S-90 as needed

Method: I originally used one of those little 6 gallon Stealth Hydro Bubbleponics kits, but have since threw it out and made a kit of my own with the same basic set up. I made a new reservoir that holds 12 gallons of water. I already triple duct taped it and put mylar on the lid. 4 inch net pots, hydroton, and rockwool cubes. Water pump with 6 outlets, 1 hose going to each of the 4 net pots, the other 2 empty so they drip water back into the res.

I got a Sunleaves UV Water Sterilizer. While I won't be able to use beneficial bacteria to my advantage, the UV light is supposed to zap any type of harmful bacteria that might grow (ie the shit that causes root rot).

I got a 600 gallon/hr air pump, 2 2 inch oxystones, 1 4 inch oxystone to aerate the water.

Seeds: The ICE plant that died spit out some seeds before its departure. It turned hermie. Since I had no more ICE seeds, I'm using the ones I got off the hermie. To my knowledge, that means there's a good chance they'll be female, but also an increased chance they'll be hermie. I'll take my chances because I want SOME DAMN ICE!!!

I have 2 small oscillating fans, 1 computer fan for intake, and some passive intakes. Still using my Homebox Clonebox.

I haven't decided if I'm going to scrog these, but I probably will. It's the best way to get the most out of limited space as far as I can tell.

Still have a good Hannah PH/EC/TDS tester.

Can't remember what else needs to be said, but I'm sure it'll come to me and I'll add it later on.

So, on Sunday night 9/14 I threw the 12 or so ICE seeds I got off my hermie in a wet paper towel, then in a tupperware container and in a kitchen cabinet. (water was RO water PH'd to 5.5, with a little Superthrive in it).

Within 24 hours, 9 of them popped. (A lot better ratio then I had with the ICE originally...)

I had soaked 8 rockwool cubes in 5.5PH RO water for 24 hours. I planted 8 of the 9 seeds in the rockwool cubes, then put them in a little nursery tray and put 2 25watt CFLs on 'em.

Within 24 hours, about half of them had sprouted.

Within another 24 hours (yesterday) all of them had sprouted. (How bout THAT success rate, Whoop whoop!)

Reproduced from my latest grow journal. Anyhow, it's only like day 3 or 4 and I'm already getting some browning on my baby girls.

PH 5.65
Ambient temp 82F
Water temp 74F

RO water with a ml/SuperThrive per gallon...

Pics:

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5 (Medium).JPG

[DarthHerbage]

My latest theory:

I still top feed the cubes a bit when I think they're dry, and I (for whatever reason) haven't been making sure not to get water on the plants when I do so. If water got on the plants, and then the light was hitting them for 18 hours would that cause this?

The other theory offered up is that it could be caused by too much wind at this early an age?

Thoughts?

Anyone?

Bueller?

Bueller?

[bombsaway]

weird. are you using CO2? if not, you're ambient temp might be a bit high. it might be high even with CO2 considering they're just babies. i don't know, never used CO2. hopefully someone else will chime in on that. but i don't think that's what causing it.

getting water on the leaves looks like it is the problem. depends on how close and intense your lights are, but the weird random pattern of browning makes sense. those little drops act like individual magnifying glasses and can really crisp the leaves. try to avoid it and see what happens. maybe use a pipette if you want to keep top watering. also, the cotyledons will brown up and fall away naturally. so don't worry about those seed leaves if they keep browning up. good luck!

[Jim Dunlop]

Originally Posted by bombsaway

also, the cotyledons will brown up and fall away naturally. so don't worry about those seed leaves if they keep browning up. good luck!

Seedlings, unlike matured plants, NEED the cotyledons at a young age because they give them a store of food/energy so they can quickly develop new, healthy growth. When your cotyledons get sick like that it means your plants have a serious problem because they are the last thing that should turn brown.

I'm just gonna throw out a guess and say that you're using too much super thrive and it's bleeding right through the leaves. You did everything else exactly right so it's really hard to come up with a good answer to your question. When I use ST I put about 2ml into my 15 gallon reservoir, it works and doesn't overdo it. I would try changing out your water and maybe even trying tap or distilled bottled water to see if your UV Sterilizer is having problems. I know with my R/O system I need to let it run for a gallon to clean it out before using the water I get from it, mainly because I only use it for my plants.

Also, I hope you aren't growing in a HydroHut, those things are instant death! Check into those things and report back! Good luck man.

[bombsaway]

Originally Posted by Jim Dunlop

Seedlings, unlike matured plants, NEED the cotyledons at a young age because they give them a store of food/energy so they can quickly develop new, healthy growth. When your cotyledons get sick like that it means your plants have a serious problem because they are the last thing that should turn brown.

I didn't say he shouldn't worry about his plant. Just that he shouldn't worry if the cotyledons don't come back, which they probably won't. cotyledons serve their purpose, but once true leaves grow, as we see in the pics, plants don't NEED them. Photosynthesis is on its merry way and that food store from the seed leaves is dwindling rapidly and not crucial. In addition, the true leaves often cannibalize the cotyledons for extra nitrogen in early plant growth to drive veg, especially when they're receiving no supplemental N like here. So browning up could be from a number of things and isn't necessarily related to the problems he's having with his true leaves. So do they look great? No. Will they recover? No. So should he worry about them from here on out? Not in my opinion. All I'm saying.

Good call on the superthrive. Didn't notice that, but yeah, wayyyy too much. 1 drop/gallon or 1-2mL/20 gallons usually is what i read.

[DarthHerbage]

Originally Posted by bombsaway

weird. are you using CO2? if not, you're ambient temp might be a bit high. it might be high even with CO2 considering they're just babies. i don't know, never used CO2. hopefully someone else will chime in on that. but i don't think that's what causing it.

getting water on the leaves looks like it is the problem. depends on how close and intense your lights are, but the weird random pattern of browning makes sense. those little drops act like individual magnifying glasses and can really crisp the leaves. try to avoid it and see what happens. maybe use a pipette if you want to keep top watering. also, the cotyledons will brown up and fall away naturally. so don't worry about those seed leaves if they keep browning up. good luck!

No CO2. Hopefully the water/light is the issue. I just have to make sure to water the cube and not let the water hit the plant from here on out. Not sure why I wasn't paying more attention to that...

Thanks for the reply.

Originally Posted by Jim Dunlop

Seedlings, unlike matured plants, NEED the cotyledons at a young age because they give them a store of food/energy so they can quickly develop new, healthy growth. When your cotyledons get sick like that it means your plants have a serious problem because they are the last thing that should turn brown.

I'm just gonna throw out a guess and say that you're using too much super thrive and it's bleeding right through the leaves. You did everything else exactly right so it's really hard to come up with a good answer to your question. When I use ST I put about 2ml into my 15 gallon reservoir, it works and doesn't overdo it. I would try changing out your water and maybe even trying tap or distilled bottled water to see if your UV Sterilizer is having problems. I know with my R/O system I need to let it run for a gallon to clean it out before using the water I get from it, mainly because I only use it for my plants.

Also, I hope you aren't growing in a HydroHut, those things are instant death! Check into those things and report back! Good luck man.

No Hydrohut, this is a Clonebox which is a type of Homebox. They've never had issues like the Hydrohuts, thankfully. As to the SuperThrive, the directions on the bottle say: "For active development,or resisting stress: 1/4tsp(1ml)per gallon or per 4 liters. 1 drop per small cupfull,3 ounces per 100 gallons.
Very soft plants or constant,daily,or maintenance use: One minim per gallon,one ounce per 500 gallons. "

So I put about 1 ml per gallon, but it was the end of the bottle so I only ended up puttin in about 10 ml for the 12 gallons of water I'm using. You still think that could be the problem?

As to the sterilizer, I have no idea. This is my first time using it, but it didn't say anything about having to run it a bit before use. It pretty much just said to stick it in there, connect an air hose, and let her rip. I'm going to try all the other options first before changing the water out. I'm going with the Lucas formula on this grow, and buying 12 gallons of RO water at a time is a PITA. I'm really hoping to not have to change out the water during this grow.

Thanks for the reply, mane.

Originally Posted by bombsaway

I didn't say he shouldn't worry about his plant. Just that he shouldn't worry if the cotyledons don't come back, which they probably won't. cotyledons serve their purpose, but once true leaves grow, as we see in the pics, plants don't NEED them. Photosynthesis is on its merry way and that food store from the seed leaves is dwindling rapidly and not crucial. In addition, the true leaves often cannibalize the cotyledons for extra nitrogen in early plant growth to drive veg, especially when they're receiving no supplemental N like here. So browning up could be from a number of things and isn't necessarily related to the problems he's having with his true leaves. So do they look great? No. Will they recover? No. So should he worry about them from here on out? Not in my opinion. All I'm saying.

Good call on the superthrive. Didn't notice that, but yeah, wayyyy too much. 1 drop/gallon or 1-2mL/20 gallons usually is what i read.

Hmm...still don't know what to think about the SuperThrive. As I said, hopefully that isn't the problem because of the whole changing the water out thing.



I haven't been able to check the girls for the last 12 hours or so (visitor) but the last time I checked they were no worse, and still seem to be growing. Hopefully it was just water getting on the plants getting magnified by the light...I guess we shall see.

Thanks again for the replies, guys.

[DarthHerbage]

The update:


I turned the oscillating fan away from the plants, and am making sure not to get water on them.

Here's how they're coming along:

(the second one looks retarded, but it's been like that since before the browning)

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I'm going to duct my AC to my closet in an attempt to bring my temperatures down. I will also be replacing my intake fan with one that is twice as powerful.

So how are they looking?

(2 of them have roots coming out of the net pots now btw)

Thanks.

[bombsaway]

look like they're doing fine. this early on, you can judge the health by looking at new growth. that new growth looks good on all of them, except for that little burned tip in pic 2. no biggie though. probably just a little lingering effect from the superthrive. everything looks great. keep on keeping on brother.