My sick little plants

[nitrobud]

Well, I think I really jumped the gun on things. I originally started the seeds not expecting them to really sprout, but sprout they did.

First started them off stupidly in some peat pots with some seed starter soil that obviously had some ferts in it (bad idea, i know now). They grew ok in them for a while, but I've since pulled most out of the pots and dropped them in some coco coir. I have also been using a very diluted hydrofuel solution as per the feeding charts that were at the store. Previous to grabbing the chart, I think I also over fed them once (1/2 strength when it should have been like 1/10).

They are in a 4.5x4.5x7 Tent under a 600 Watt HPS. I think the temps were getting a bit high, so I raised the light to see if that would help.

I've attached some photos, but I will try and see about taking some more with compensation for the HPS lighting.

I noticed a few aphids also, not many, about 4-5 mainly on one plant. I've kept an eye on it so far and kill them as I see them. I haven't had to kill more then 2 or 3 at a time, so I haven't used any chemicals yet.

My assumption is that they are burnt, and burnt bad... Hopefully I can make them come back to life, else I guess I will grab some rockwool and go full hydro and finish my last bubbler buckets. I was just going to use these ones as mothers for clones as they are seeds I had given to me.

I'll get some properly coloured photos

[nitrobud]

What type of medium; soil or hydro? Started in soil, dropped into coco
What brand and type of soil? Scotts seed starter mix, now in GH Cocotek
Indoors or outdoors? Indoors
What strain? Unknown
How old are the plants? Almost 3 weeks, only almost 1 under the HPS (200w T5HO before)
What type of lights and how many watts? Currently a 600watt HPS
How far from the lights? 1 foot, now further then that 1.5 maybe 2 (guesstimate)
What, how much and when was it fed? NPK? Hydrofuel Groi A+B
What is the medium/runoff pH? Was unadjusted tap water before ~PH7
What are the temps and humidity in the room? 40% humidity, 20c in tent, hit 29c at plant level before moving the light, now 24c
What size pots? 3 Gallons
Any bugs? Look real close. Just a few aphids which I have killed by hand. Only see 2 or 3 max and only on one plant (odd due to close proximity)
Any other pertinent info? I screwed up feeding them before 3 weeks old

[nitrobud]

Here are some more photos with white balance properly adjusted. No need to shut off HPS, just adjust camera settings.

Yellowing starts at veins and goes outwards. That is part of what makes me assume nute burn. I am watering with only PH adjusted water for now.

[nitrobud]

I notice more aphids then I previously thought, but I still doubt they caused this as they are very few in numbers and only on a couple plants. I'm going to start off treating them with some tobacco soaked in water to make a nicotine spray.

Little buggers must have hitched a ride on me. I do notice ZERO on the catnip plant in the same room that has tons of new growth to nibble on, looking online I see "Catnip is unliked by Ants, Aphids, Cockroaches, Flea Beetle, Japanese Beetles".

Must... Kill.... Aphids!

[SmknVTEC]

Neem oil baby. You need them all dead. I think they are hurting the plants. Otherwise the general health of the plant looks pretty good.

[gord420]

really fast growth for 3 weeks from seed. Mine have been going a month and have 1 leafset.

[nitrobud]

The T5-HO floros did a very good job. I am also running the lights 24/7 and they were not under good lights for the first week.

Once the problems started to show and the leaves started to yellow, the growth slowed and almost stopped, but it does appear to be picking back up again.

Going to home depot today to grab a bottle of neem spray I've seen there before. If it doesn't look good I'll hit the actual hydro shop.

[nitrobud]

I've started treating the plants for aphids. I bought both neem oil spray and a can of Doktor Doom Botanics for edible plants. Has the highest concentration of pyrethrum available in a plant spray in Canada: 0.20%... breaks down in about 3 days so absolutly no issues for these small plants. Will be long gone before smoked.

I mainly didn't use the neem because it didn't say it was for anything but making leaves shiny. I know it possibly would have worked, but I wanted to be sure these buggers were gone so I went chemical, but something that was safe enough to eat after 3 days.

I sprayed too much on the plants though, just needed a mist and I somehow soaked them, the thing pumps out the spray... I grabbed a spray bottle of pure water and just sprayed off the leaf tops to prevent problems. I'll spray again tomorrow if I see any or the next day either way to be sure.

Sucks, the plants have barely stared and I have to deal with aphids. I bet they were on the plants before I even moved them into the tent last week. Luckly, there haven't been many and I kill every single one I see by hand.

I also haven't watered in 2 days to allow the top of the soil to dry out more and not harbour these evil buggers. Soil is still moist under top layer so no worries. But I still need to flush these buckets so it kinda sucks.

Good thing I still have 20+ of these random seeds left. If it comes down to it. I'll kill these plants and move on to new ones starting in rockwool and putting direct into custom bubblers once sprouted.

I never had any of these issues last times I've grown.

I guess I'll wait at least a few hours then turn the lights back on. They have been running 24/7, the pants can have a break. I made sure to keep the bubbler on though.

[nitrobud]

It has been over 24H now and I see no aphids. I'll wait until tomorrow before spraying and see if I see any more.

now to fix the yellowing of the leaves. I got the evidence I needed of the nutes in the starter soil. I found one of those time/water released nutes in the form of a ball you can squish and pop. They must be increasing the levels beyond the delute ones I was trying.

At least the plant, even with some yellowing (pH is ideal and PPM is @ 440 /w light nutes) in the bubbler bucket is doing ok.

I also notice the plants, though yellowish, are still growing. The one that was accidently topped has offshoots that have increased in size over the last 24h. I always forget how yellow the HPS light makes the plants look. I pull them out under a daylight CFL and they look nice and green. They do still have yellowing from the veins outward. But I assume that is nute burn, because if it was deficent it should go inwards towards the veins, correct?

[SmknVTEC]

Yup that would be a fert ball indicating time release nutes which is bad. Your plants look ok though.

[nitrobud]

The plants seem to actually have nute lockup possibly as the new growth has come out a very white. This is along with the yellowing that was happening vein outward on the older growth. But they are still growing! So I haven't killed them yet.

I poured some water through the bucket and tested the pH. Water in was 5.4 (just a little under ideal as it will mix still) water out was 6.2+ I guess that means the soil was towards pH7 which would make sense as I think I accidently soaked the coco in that (don't remember 100%)

I think I might have been watering (and soaked the block in, whoops!) pH7 water from the tap. From what I've read, coco should be @ ~pH5.8 so this was proably a bad thing on my part. From now on I'm filling 5gallon buckets with water, getting ideal pH and then using that water. Of course, I should have been doing this from the beginning but this is a trial run at this point.

What should the pH be for a bubbler bucket, same as Coco 5.8?
And is it normal for tap water to be 10ppm only? I calibrated the meter and was surprised with this reading. After adding light nutes and adjusting pH I get ~ 480ppm if I remember correctly.

[SmknVTEC]

Originally Posted by nitrobud

What should the pH be for a bubbler bucket, same as Coco 5.8?
And is it normal for tap water to be 10ppm only? I calibrated the meter and was surprised with this reading. After adding light nutes and adjusting pH I get ~ 480ppm if I remember correctly.

Yes 5.2-5.8 for both. Yes I suppose 10 ppm tap is possible. Consider yourself lucky. 480 on the ppm w/nutes sounds fine too but I admittedly don't grow hydro/cocoa/perlite, etc.