Operation: Fast and Furious! (ARE YOU FUCKING SHITTING ME?)

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Rotties4Ever, Oct 9, 2011.

  1. Operation Fast and Furious was a sting run by the
    United States Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco,
    Firearms and Explosives (ATF) between 2009 and
    2010 as part of Project Gunrunner in its investigations
    into illegal gun trafficking . The stated purpose of the
    operation was to permit otherwise-suspected
    straw purchasers to complete the weapon's
    purchase and transit to Mexico, in order to build
    a bigger case against Mexican criminal
    organizations suspected of being the ultimate buyer.

    [1] The operation started in the fall of 2009 and
    ended in late 2010 shortly after the death of Brian
    Terry, a US Border Patrol Agent and has since
    become the subject of controversy and a
    U.S. congressional investigation. During the
    operation, the sale of at least 2,000 guns were
    facilitated by ATF knowing most would be trafficked
    to Mexico. By June, 2011, the guns have
    been linked (through eTrace, ATF's electronic
    tracing program) to some 179 crime scenes in
    Mexico.[2][3]

    By August, 2011, 21 additional guns
    were recovered from violent crime scenes in Mexico.
    [4] Of the 2,000 guns knowingly released by ATF
    agents, only 600 are reported as recovered by officials.
    The remaining 1,400 guns have not been recovered.

    Operation Fast and Furious - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
  2. The following are 22 shocking facts about this:

    #1 During Operation Fast and Furious, ATF agents purposely allowed thousands of guns to be sold to individuals that they believed would get them into the hands of Mexican drug cartels.

    #2 ATF agents were specifically ordered not to intercept the guns before they crossed the border. The following is a brief excerpt from a CBS News report that detailed the fierce objections that many ATF agents expressed when they were ordered to stand down....

    On the phone, one Project Gunrunner source (who didn't want to be identified) told us just how many guns flooded the black market under ATF's watchful eye. "The numbers are over 2,500 on that case by the way. That's how many guns were sold - including some 50-calibers they let walk."

    50-caliber weapons are fearsome. For months, ATF agents followed 50-caliber Barrett rifles and other guns believed headed for the Mexican border, but were ordered to let them go. One distraught agent was often overheard on ATF radios begging and pleading to be allowed to intercept transports. The answer: "Negative. Stand down."

    CBS News has been told at least 11 ATF agents and senior managers voiced fierce opposition to the strategy. "It got ugly..." said one. There was "screaming and yelling" says another. A third warned: "this is crazy, somebody is gonna to get killed."

    #3 Operation Fast and Furious remained a secret until the murder of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry last December. Two guns that were sold during Operation Fast and Furious were found at the scene of the murder.

    #4 ATF Special Agent John Dodson was one of the first to blow the whistle on Operation Fast and Furious. Dodson explained to the House Government Reform and Oversight Committee on June 15, 2011 that many ATF agents were becoming extremely frustrated when they were ordered to cut off surveillance on the weapons that were being sold because they knew "that just days after these purchases, the guns that we saw these individuals buy would begin turning up at crime scenes in the United States and Mexico."

    #5 It appears that Operation Fast and Furious began some time around September 2009. At that time, the ATF began pressuring gun shops near the border with Mexico to participate in a new covert operation that was being set up. The gun store owners were told to help the ATF get guns into the hands of people that would take them back to the Mexican drug cartels.

    The following description of the mechanics of Operation Fast and Furious comes from a recent Los Angeles Times article....

    In the fall of 2009, ATF agents installed a secret phone line and hidden cameras in a ceiling panel and wall at Andre Howard's Lone Wolf gun store. They gave him one basic instruction: Sell guns to every illegal purchaser who walks through the door.

    For 15 months, Howard did as he was told. To customers with phony IDs or wads of cash he normally would have turned away, he sold pistols, rifles and semiautomatics. He was assured by the ATF that they would follow the guns, and that the surveillance would lead the agents to the violent Mexican drug cartels on the Southwest border.

    When Howard heard nothing about any arrests, he questioned the agents. Keep selling, they told him. So hundreds of thousands of dollars more in weapons, including .50-caliber sniper rifles, walked out of the front door of his store in a Glendale, Ariz., strip mall.

    #6 In some gun stores, cameras were set up so that top ATF officials could actually watch these transactions take place. Back in June, U.S. Representative Darrell Issa stated the following....

    "Acting Director Melson was able to sit at his desk in Washington and himself watch a live feed of straw buyers entering the gun stores and purchasing dozens of AK-47 variants."

    #7 It has also come out that in some cases ATF agents were actually the ones buying the guns and getting them into the hands of Mexican drug cartels. The following is how author Michael A. Walsh recently explained this in an article in the New York Post....

    This just might be the smoking gun we’ve been waiting for to break the festering “Fast and Furious” gun-running scandal wide open: the Department of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives apparently ordered one of its own agents to purchase firearms with taxpayer money, and sell them directly to a Mexican drug cartel.

    Let that sink in: After months of pretending that “Fast and Furious” was a botched surveillance operation of illegal gun-running spearheaded by the ATF and the US attorney’s office in Phoenix, it turns out that the government itself was selling guns to the bad guys.
     
  3. #8 According to the Los Angeles Times, guns that were purchased during Operation Fast and Furious have "turned up at dozens of additional Mexican crime scenes, with an unconfirmed toll of at least 150 people killed or wounded."

    #9 Mexican authorities were never informed that thousands upon thousands of guns were being allowed into Mexico.

    #10 Authorities in Mexico have asked the U.S. government over and over to explain what in the world happened during Operation Fast and Furious but they have not been given an adequate answer. In fact, according to the Los Angeles Times, the Obama administration has not even responded to questions from the attorney general of Mexico....

    Marisela Morales, Mexico's attorney general and a longtime favorite of American law enforcement agents in Mexico, told The Times that she first learned about Fast and Furious from news reports. And to this day, she said, U.S. officials have not briefed her on the operation gone awry, nor have they apologized.

    #11 U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder has been withholding key documents about Fast and Furious from Congress and has been consistently stonewalling U.S. Representative Darrell Issa, U.S. Senator Chuck Grassley and other members of Congress that have attempted to look into this matter.

    #12 The acting director of the ATF, Kenneth Melson, had been cooperating with the investigation. At the end of August he was suddenly transferred to the Justice Department's Office of Legal Policy.

    #13 Several other key officials that were heavily involved in Operation Fast and Furious actually got promoted.

    #14 On May 3rd, U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder testified under oath in front of the House Judiciary Committee on Operation Fast and Furious. During that testimony, Holder made the following statement....

    "I probably heard about Fast and Furious for the first time over the last few weeks."

    #15 Since that time, a large amount of evidence has come out that Holder was not telling the truth. For example, a recent Fox News article discussed some of the very revealing memos about Fast and Furious that have been discovered recently....

    However, newly discovered memos suggest otherwise. For instance, one memo dated July 2010 shows Michael Walther, director of the National Drug Intelligence Center, told Holder that straw buyers in the Fast and Furious operation "are responsible for the purchase of 1,500 firearms that were then supplied to the Mexican drug trafficking cartels."

    Other documents also indicate that Holder began receiving weekly briefings on the program from the National Drug Intelligence Center "beginning, at the latest, on July 5, 2010,"
     
  4. #16 Holder now claims that he simply misunderstood the question. He now says that he had heard of Operation Fast and Furious previously but that he was not aware of the specific details.

    #17 Emails exchanged between two Department of Justice officials last October make it abundantly clear that high level officials at the DOJ were very aware of what was going on...

    Two Justice Department officials mulled it over in an email exchange Oct. 18, 2010. "It's a tricky case given the number of guns that have walked but is a significant set of prosecutions," says Jason Weinstein, Deputy Assistant Attorney General of the Criminal Division. Deputy Chief of the National Gang Unit James Trusty replies "I'm not sure how much grief we get for 'guns walking.' It may be more like, "Finally they're going after people who sent guns down there."

    #18 House Republicans are now asking for a special prosecutor to be appointed to investigate whether or not U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder lied to Congress during his recent testimony in front of the House Judiciary Committee on Operation Fast and Furious.

    #19 U.S. Representative Darrell Issa believes that those involved in the Fast and Furious gun trafficking operation may have violated international arms trafficking agreements and could potentially face very serious criminal charges.

    #20 U.S. Senator Chuck Grassley is absolutely convinced that a major coverup is going on....

    "But I can tell you this. They're doing everything they can, in a fast and furious way, to cover up all the evidence or stonewalling us. But here's the issue, if he didn't perjure himself and didn't know about it, the best way that they can help us, Congressman Issa and me, is to just issue all the documents that we ask for and those documents will prove one way or the other right or wrong."

    #21 Did Barack Obama ever know about Operation Fast and Furious? He says that he did not authorize the program. On March 22, 2011 Obama made the following statement....

    "I did not authorize [Fast and Furious]. Eric Holder, the attorney general, did not authorize it. There may be a situation here in which a serious mistake was made. If that’s the case, then we’ll find — find out and we’ll hold somebody accountable."

    #22 CBS News investigative journalist Sharyl Attkisson claimed on the Laura Ingraham show the other day that officials in the Obama administration were literally screaming and yelling at her for aggressively investigating the Fast and Furious scandal....

    Ingraham: So they were literally screaming at you?
    Attkisson: Yes. Well the DOJ woman was just yelling at me. The guy from the White House on Friday night literally screamed at me and cussed at me. [Laura: Who was the person? Who was the person at Justice screaming?] Eric Schultz. Oh, the person screaming was [DOJ spokeswoman] Tracy Schmaler, she was yelling not screaming. And the person who screamed at me was Eric Schultz at the White House."

    Where there is smoke there is usually fire.

    Something about this whole thing really stinks.

    It would be a shame if Operation Fast and Furious is allowed to be swept under the rug.

    The weapons sold during Operation Fast and Furious are going to be used to kill a lot of people. The legacy of this scandal will be felt on both sides of the border for years to come.

    The Mexican government deserves some answers.

    The American people deserve some answers.

    Hopefully we will get some.


    The link for all the facts:
    Fast And Furious: 22 Shocking Facts About The Scandal That Could Bring Down The Obama Administration

    I suggest you click on it, you will find that it also has links of its own to back it all up right there, for all the lazies: all the search is done for you, just click on it with an open mind and make your own informed independent decision.
     
  5. Don't you just love the news coverage of this. I know it do.
     
  6. Who said I have to gain something? Clearly you just heard of it, so I pointed out it had been reported months ago.
     
  7. This is old news, same cats gonna be playing the same cards and will have 8 lives left to spare. So to this whole ordeal all I gotta say is "Sowhut"
     
  8. I heard the name and knew it was a scandal, but I did NO research into it whatsoever until about a week ago (didn't even look it up to see what it was).

    When I learned about it, I almost vomited.

    Those people running (in) those cartels are NO ONE to fuck with. And we let 2,000 high-caliber firearms through - while only recovering a few.

    :mad:
     
  9. Bureaucracy at its finest. This is just more evidence that ATF is an incompetent organization with far too much power.
     
  10. i dont know how to tell you this, but this was signed by and could not have been put in motion with out the say so of the obummer-in-cheif

    again: the incompetent atf organization as you refered to them, are but one of many symptoms of the disease.
     
  11. he must be ATF counter-intelligence e-agent ;)



    old as hell...
     
  12. thank you for that awesome contribution to the thread and the topic.

    you are so cool.
     
  13. Yes, I'm aware of Obama's involvement (and his false claims that he knew about the operation but didn't know what it was). However the office of President is not something I'd be okay with eliminating. The ATF, however, could disappear and the only thing we would notice is fewer infringements on our constitutional rights, and fewer Mexican gunrunners.
     
  14. I agree with you on the atf thing, sadly most people find them useful
     
  15. hey man, just cause you said something not too smart and posted a thread on a topic that's almost a year old doesn't mean you gotta be sarcastic and try to insult me

    heres my contribution :
    Grasscity.com Forums - Search Forums
     
  16. #18 Rotties4Ever, Oct 10, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 10, 2011
    stop reading there, it got way too intelligent for me

    edit- thats two rubbish posts in my thread that have nothing to do with op

    awesome. i love it when people got nothing better to do
     
  17. :confused:
    you okay?
     
  18. #20 LurkMode7.62, Oct 10, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 10, 2011
    I'm not as scared of a Mexican with a Barrett from Tennessee as I am of a Mexican who bought a full-auto Chinese AK-47 that came up from Mexico's southern border. :cool:
    I've already said once on this forum that converting an NFA compliant firearm is much more tedious than simply buying one that comes up from the southern border with select-fire capabilities already in it from the factory.

    Yes, it is possible to buy a select-fire capable weapon in the US, but the hoops to jump through and paperwork involved make it very very very difficult for a strawman or someone using false ID to purchase one. Anyone with the machine shop skills and equipment to make the drop-in sear or drill the receiver and add the traditional auto sear, and fabricate the other parts to convert a CAR-15 into an M-16 can run off a job lot of Sten guns with half the effort and money.:poke:

    It takes a great deal of training to properly use a high-caliber rifle. You don't use a Barrett to knock off a convenience store. You're talking about a 57 inch, 31 pound rifle. These things are used for long range shooting that takes extensive training to set the skills, and practice to keep the skills current. Since each round of .50BMG costs from $4.00 to $7.00, keeping the skills up is expensive. the ballistics involved require formal training to learn, you don't just figure out things like long range windage effects and ballistics calculations by plinking at tin cans blades.

    I'm just worried that they are going to use this shit as another excuse to clamp down on OUR rights as Americans.
     

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