Obama's CAP and TAX will destroy the nation

[maxrule]

First of all, this is a scam and we all know this.

It is a fraud that will only take more capital out of private hands and transfer it to government.

Just think about what is going to happen to energy intensive jobs like manufacturing and construction in this country.

They are going to be forced to lay people off, and everything that is left will move over seas.

You can't replace coal and nuclear with solar and wind. That is just ridiculous to the extreme.

Not to mention that Pelosi, Gore, Reed, Obama, and the rest of them will be CONSUMING THEIR ASSES OFF because they can afford it no matter how high prices climb.

The act of causing prices to rise simply for the sake of forcing you to use less is detremental to mankind and INSANE!!!

Force food prices to rise and you will eat less, force gas prices to rise and you'll drive less. Force business expensis to rise and you'll work less. Force cigerette prices to rise an you will smoke less, force alchohol prices to rice and you drink less, force the price of EVERYTHING to rise and you will LIVE LESS.

I want you to think about your grandparents who may be barely getting by now. What are they going to do with prices of everything go up?

Wind and solar don't work adequately enough and we all know this.

There was a guy who put one little wind turbine on his roof and his neighbors complained of the noise and forced him to shut it down.

And then there is this....

Google's $1,500 coffee makers

Google Inc. spends quite a lot of time burnishing its self-created image as a "green" company – largely on the basis of the solar array at its corporate headquarters. It is also trying to build support for the administration's cap-and-trade "energy" bill by pretending that solar energy can substitute for hydrocarbon, nuclear and hydroelectric energy.

Google states that its multimillion-dollar solar array has generated sufficient electricity over the past two years to run 5,158 coffee makers for one hour each day. Google does not mention, however, that this solar array supplies insufficient electricity to run Google's search engine computers for even one minute per day and that the coffee makers, if supplied with solar panels to operate them, would cost approximately $1,500 each.

Google claims that its Mountain View, Calif., headquarters buildings are paved with 1.6 megawatts (Mw) of solar panels. This installation was completed in June 2007, about the same time as the Nellis Air Force Base 14 Mw, $100 million solar panel installation that "energy expert" Obama – who is now attempting to seize control of the energy industries of the United States – visited recently and advertised as an example of his administration's plans for America.

As of June 21, 2009, Google reports that it has generated 4,592,364 kilowatt (Kw) hours of electricity with this installation, or about 2.29 gigawatt (Gw) hours per year. Nellis reports 30.1 Gw hours per year. So, Nellis is producing 25 percent of its advertised quantity and Google is producing 16 percent. The apparent 75 percent and 84 percent losses arise because the sun does not shine 24 hours per day and because these installations are routinely overrated. In fact, the Google installation actually generates, on average, only 0.26 megawatts – not 1.6 megawatts (1 Gw = 1,000 Mw = 1,000,000 Kw).

[letsgetPOD]

This bill is paving the way for agenda 21.

[wackdeafboy]

Originally Posted by maxrule

You can't replace coal and nuclear with solar and wind. That is just ridiculous to the extreme.

Exactly! I'm 100% nuclear supporter. Going wind energy is going backwards. It simply takes too much space and doesn't deliver good watts. Solar on the other hand, pricey but don't have to pay monthly to companies for it. It all yours.

[ciao stupido]

Point is, this si happening wayy to early. The technology is still too much in its infancy to be fully utilized. Wait about 15-20 years, then it might be viable. But right now, all its gonna do is put more people out of jobs & make it harder to live.

[420420420]

If this hasn't been posted yet, a trade war with China will most likely occur because of this

Is a Trade War with China Brewing? - TIME

A Trade War with China? | Foreign Affairs

the House bill has a provision that would impose tariffs on goods imported from countries that don't match U.S. carbon dioxide restrictions -- a slap at China and India that some business interests fear could provoke a trade war.

[Nokturnal420]

Originally Posted by maxrule

Force food prices to rise and you will eat less, force gas prices to rise and you'll drive less. Force business expensis to rise and you'll work less. Force cigerette prices to rise an you will smoke less, force alchohol prices to rice and you drink less

That all sounds good actually. Now all we need to do is give the money from the rich and upper middle class to food for poor and we're straight. Shit, all I need is a bed, some food, and some weed.

[stoned budda]

Originally Posted by Nokturnal420

That all sounds good actually. Now all we need to do is give the money from the rich and upper middle class to food for poor and we're straight. Shit, all I need is a bed, some food, and some weed.

Ah, your just being sarcastic right?

[Mist425]

Originally Posted by Dronetek

People need cheap fuel to go to work and pay their bills.

There's always carpooling and public transportation.

Raising those costs does not bring down the prices of technologies that aren't cost effective. Thats the problem with trying to force things on to people that haven't come up through the free market.

The higher fuel prices are, the greater the demand will be for fuel-efficient vehicles. That does not mean people will automatically be able to afford them, it just means they would buy such an automobile if it were affordable.

Conversely, it means that demand for gas-guzzling vehicles will decrease; since gas prices are high these vehicles become relatively more expensive.

Can you not see that these two forces at work mean that car companies would begin allocating more money for research and development of fuel efficiency and hybrid technologies? The first truly affordable hybrids will sell like hotcakes and the first company to sell it will reap tremendous profits. The higher the price for gas the more demand for fuel-efficient technologies there will be, the more demand the greater R&D, the greater R&D the cheaper the car.

First of all, why were high gas prices reason to hate Bush, but now its actually good to force gas prices to sky rocket?

I can't ever recall hating on Bush because gas prices were high. Don't hang a sign on me d00d

How in the world will less money in people's pockets "spur innovation"? Its more likely that this is a pipe dream and you're just going to end up sending lots of people to the poor house. The people who are already in the poor house are going to get hit even harder. Why do you think its a good idea to force this on to people?

As for how it will spur innovation, please see my previous explanation. As to why I think it's good: dependence on foreign oil is bad, moreover, dependence on any finite resource is bad. Pollution is bad; it hurts plant and animal ecosystems and it's bad for human respiratory health. Plus, if carbon emissions by humans do actually contribute to global warming in a big way (not saying they do, just saying if) then we're covered there.

What do you have against freedom?
Nothing. I'm just trying to get America less dependent of foreign oil. What do you have against America Dronetek?

In Spain this is causing 18% unemployment. People cant go to work with windmills

Millers across Spain would disagree with you.

and most people cant afford a hybrid. They need cheap fuel and energy in order to survive.

In the long run I imagine this will make fuel cheaper.

Huh? So, people are going to have less money and this is somehow goign to allow them to buy an expensive hybrid? What if they lose their job, because energy prices have skyrocketed?

I'm sure some people will be left unemployed because of this exact reason (rising energy costs). At the same time I'm sure some people will be employed because of that same reason; someone needs to build those wind farms/solar panels, someone needs to design them, someone needs to transport them, etc.

What evidence is there for this? The one place thats already doing it (Spain), its failing miserably.

I'm not familiar with the economic history of Spain but I'd venture to guess that there are differences between the U.S and Spain that make it a more viable plan here than there. For example, we have that stimulus bill that has funding for such projects. Also, is it possible that Spain's unemployment could be more closely related to factors other than their energy costs?

Your problem is this is all based on a religious belief that man made Co2 is destroying the planet.

That's not why I support the bill.

Its a belief that isn't backed up by good science. You're basically forcing people to pay a sin tax, like the Catholics did in the dark ages.

Yup...

[Gooch_Goblin69]

Originally Posted by maxrule

Congress votes on Cap and Tax this friday.

I can't figure out how Obama can have any support left. How could anyone be isane enough to support this?

There will be no jobs left in this country if Obama gets his way.

I tried to warn people about this before the election.

China must look very appealing to any US business right now.



YouTube - Warren Buffett Slams "Cap and Trade" as a Regressive Tax on All Americans

YouTube - FOX News Reports on Democrats' Massive Energy Tax Hike

Coal electricity prices would skyrocket becuase of the environmental constraints but hrydo power would not, which is what my state, washington, uses.

[stoned budda]

Introducing the GOP’s Cap-And-Tax 8…Remember these names at the polls....

Photoshop credit: Leo Alberti
I listed them earlier tonight, but am breaking out a separate post to spotlight them again.
The 8 cap-and-tax Republican turncoats again are:
Bono Mack (CA) (202) 225-5330
Castle (DE) (202) 225-4165
Kirk (IL) (202) 225-4385 (And he’s seriously considering running for Senate!)
Lance (NJ) (202) 225-5361
LoBiondo (NJ) (202) 225-6572
McHugh (NY) (202) 225-4611
Reichert (WA) (202) 225-7761
Smith (NJ) (202) 225-3765

******Don't stop now people, contact your senator, this bill is expected to have a tougher battle in the senate.

[EbencoyE]

Originally Posted by Metal_Rain

I wonder what would happen if my little white ass strolled into the ghetto? Would I be greeted by nice people who are all about equality, or would I get mugged?

I've been to the ghetto plenty of times. Even lived there, and my white ass was fine. Enjoyed living there MUCH more than in the rich suburbs where everyone in this thread is probably too scared to venture out of if you actually believe you're going to get mugged by hanging around minorities...

The point of my post was that the majority of blacks (or hispanics) live in these areas because the majority of them are poor as shit and are basically slaves to white people.

But yeah, they just don't work hard enough. It's always THEIR fault. Slavery is gone so any situation they live in now is obviously self-imposed... you guys are funny.

[EbencoyE]

Originally Posted by Metal_Rain

What I meant is precisely what you said. They've been dumbed down and led to believe that hating the white race is justified, in quite a similar way as many white people have. I suppose I didn't make that message clear enough.

What? Who hates white people? Who dumbed them down and told them hating the white race was justified? What are you talking about? What have you been smoking? Stick to pot dude!

[stoned budda]

Originally Posted by EbencoyE

What? Who hates white people? Who dumbed them down and told them hating the white race was justified? What are you talking about? What have you been smoking? Stick to pot dude!

Race baiting poverty pimps such as the Rev. Jackson, Al Sharpton, The Rev. Wright, N.A.A.C.P. etc.

Its not hate as much as its preaching miss trust. Only a small majority of blacks actually hate whites, just as a small proportion of the white community actually hates blacks.

You see there's money to be made off of racism. If there's no racism then there's no need for these people, they are out of work. Black theology, the black power movement, etc. are ultimately designed to keep the African American community mentally segregated.

They are no better than the white power groups. Not like them exactly but all the same, none the better.


Hating or mistrusting someone based on the color of their skin is the stupidest thing i've ever heard of,but it does exist.

[Mist425]

Originally Posted by stoned budda

Race baiting poverty pimps such as the Rev. Jackson, Al Sharpton, The Rev. Wright, N.A.A.C.P. etc.

Its not hate as much as its preaching miss trust. Only a small majority of blacks actually hate whites, just as a small proportion of the white community actually hates blacks.

You see there's money to be made off of racism. If there's no racism then there's no need for these people, they are out of work. Black theology, the black power movement, etc. are ultimately designed to keep the African American community mentally segregated.

They are no better than the white power groups. Not like them exactly but all the same, none the better.


Hating or mistrusting someone based on the color of their skin is the stupidest thing i've ever heard of,but it does exist.

Can't you see the difference between the Black Panthers and the KKK? I sure as hell don't agree with all that 'white devil' shit just like I don't agree with the Klan's 'black/jew/catholic devil' shit. The difference is the KKK's goal is to keep blacks down while the Panthers' goal is to allow blacks to rise up (socioeconomically).

Don't dislike Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson just because they talk about racism. Granted, that's all they talk about so that can get annoying, but it's not as if racism only exists in America because those people choose to talk about it.

[stoned budda]

Originally Posted by Mist425

Can't you see the difference between the Black Panthers and the KKK? I sure as hell don't agree with all that 'white devil' shit just like I don't agree with the Klan's 'black/jew/catholic devil' shit. The difference is the KKK's goal is to keep blacks down while the Panthers' goal is to allow blacks to rise up (socioeconomically).

Don't dislike Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson just because they talk about racism. Granted, that's all they talk about so that can get annoying, but it's not as if racism only exists in America because those people choose to talk about it.

Even though they are different in their methodology, they are both equally guilty of racism. The black panthers are just as racist as the The white supremacist movement. When the Black Panthers started up back in 1966, in California, they were founded for the Self-Defense of the black community and establishment of real economic, social, and political equality across gender and color lines. Today they are a loosely affiliated group of race baiting extortionist.

Never said racism exist because of Jesse or Al, or the black panther (who i don't think i eve mentioned in my original post), i said they fuel it with in the black community to cause dissension in order to extort money from communities and corporations and political power.