Why is weed some kind of wonderdrug?

[DaleGribble]

IM not saying a drug that relieves symptoms isnt a real drug, Im just saying a real medicine stops the symptoms from happening whereas it seems weed just makes you too high to notice them, which any intoxicant is capable of.

Originally Posted by The Budmaster

I have to admit though, the fact that you actually said that you can get high enough on heroine or alcohol to make you forget your symptoms... and that puts MJ on the same level as those drugs (Yeah... forget the the fact that heroine fucks up your body like nothing else and has probably killed millions by this point, and alcohol has also killed millions... and then add in that marijuana hasn't EVER killed a single human being... but yeah, somehow they are the same?)... Makes me think that this argument is completely lost on you.

-The Budmaster

Then it would seem the core of my argument has already been lost on you.

[Medicine Al]

This is another backhanded slam on the efficacy of natural medicine in general.

Dale, this is so basic, it should only be interesting to small children.

Use the word Cannabis, there is no 'Weed' here in this forum.

You sound like a jealous alcoholic junkie.

DaleGribble-
IM not saying a drug that relieves symptoms isnt a real drug, Im just saying a real medicine stops the symptoms from happening whereas it seems weed just makes you too high to notice them, which any intoxicant is capable of.

This is one seriously unobservant individual.

Analgesic is medicine. Anti-Carcinogenic is medicine. Anti Inflammatory is medicine. And Cannabis is all of these and more.

You are just a pool of wasted youth, DaleGribble.

Don't come into the Medical forum with your beer goggles on.

[carvershores]

Originally Posted by Medicine Al

This is another backhanded slam on the efficacy of natural medicine in general.

Dale, this is so basic, it should only be interesting to small children.

Use the word Cannabis, there is no 'Weed' here in this forum.

You sound like a jealous alcoholic junkie.




This is one seriously unobservant individual.

Analgesic is medicine. Anti-Carcinogenic is medicine. Anti Inflammatory is medicine. And Cannabis is all of these and more.

You are just a pool of wasted youth, DaleGribble.

Don't come into the Medical forum with your beer goggles on.

Well please enlighten us, because his arguments are making perfect sense and hes not being in the least bit disrespectful... So please, do tell

[blackened85]

Originally Posted by DaleGribble

IM not saying a drug that relieves symptoms isnt a real drug, Im just saying a real medicine stops the symptoms from happening whereas it seems weed just makes you too high to notice them, which any intoxicant is capable of.


Then it would seem the core of my argument has already been lost on you.

So, by your logic opiates aren't "real" drugs either.

[DaleGribble]

Originally Posted by carvershores

Well please enlighten us, because his arguments are making perfect sense and hes not being in the least bit disrespectful... So please, do tell

Thank you. I believe that is obvious to anyone with critical thinking and the ability to put passion aside for objectivity.

Originally Posted by Medicine Al

Analgesic is medicine. Anti-Carcinogenic is medicine. Anti Inflammatory is medicine. And Cannabis is all of these and more.

You are just a pool of wasted youth, DaleGribble.

Don't come into the Medical forum with your beer goggles on.

I have yet to see how smoking marijuana can be anticarcinogenic. Analgesics dull nerves, not make you ignore them. And as far as weed being anti-inflammatory, yet also a dialator and an increaser of blood pressure, again, must be magic.

I'm not wasted youth at all. Just because I drink alcohol you claim I'm an alcoholic? And Ive never used an opiate recreationally in my life, only after knee surgery when smoking INCREASED my joint pain and opiates indeed alleviated it. And why would I be jealous??? Get a clue.

Theres something to be said when there are comparable amounts of people in the medical marijuana "community" that are simply getting high to those that are only doing it for medical reasons. Seems that taking medicine that gets you high is a better option every time to me...

[The Budmaster]

Originally Posted by DaleGribble

IM not saying a drug that relieves symptoms isnt a real drug, Im just saying a real medicine stops the symptoms from happening whereas it seems weed just makes you too high to notice them, which any intoxicant is capable of.

And with this statement, you have lost all credibility. Seriously... did you not even read what I wrote?

Let me break it down for you in a more simple manner.

Sick people want safe (Healthy) relief from there symptoms. If they don't want to feel pain, anything that takes the pain away is a treatment regardless of if it makes them high.

How would a doctor solve pain? He would prescribe powerful painkillers like Oxycodone or Percocet or Vicodin... all drugs that make you completely "high" when you take them. However most people don't want to take those drugs as they can do significant damage to your body and give you a host of other negative side effects like constipation, nausea, itching, sleeplessness, vomiting, and weakness. Now, even with my basic understanding of medicine and brain chemistry, I understand that "too high to notice pain" isn't a medically informed phrase.

Cannabis and Oxycodone and Percocet and Vicodin all work in the exact same basic way. They all BLOCK pain. Or, specifically, they engage receptors in your brain that make you feel pain. When the actual pain signals come through your body and reach your brain, they can't access those receptors because they are already being engaged by another chemical (Like THC for example)... and stops the pain from actually activating anything in the brain.

What you are saying about it just being "Too high to notice" is completely unfounded and offbase medically. It's not the high that makes you not feel the pain (or any other symptom), there is stuff going on in the brain that chemically stops you from feeling the pain... not just forget it or not notice it.

As I said, every single painkiller out there works the EXACT same way. Every painkiller out there makes you feel "High". Every painkiller besides cannabis has been shown to do significant damage to the body after extended use. Not cannabis.

-The Budmaster

Edit: And why did you not find pain relief? Every painkiller acts on different pain receptors in the brain. Essentially what every drug does is mimic a drug that is already in your body that can engage specific receptors. THC mimics one set of receptors, morphine mimics another set, percocet another... so on and so forth. That's why there is not just one blanket drug for painkilling. Every patient reacts different, some find relief better with other drugs.

[DaleGribble]

An opiate at appropriate level doesnt make you feel nearly as fucked up as weed though, not to mention it comes in prescrible doses that can be regulated. And side by side, i am certain those painkillers would act to block pain receptors far more effectively than marijuana in doses from smoking.

And I didnt find pain relief because I had swelling that was worsened by weed dilating my blood vessels.

And why did we switch to only speaking about painkilling capabilities? I already admitted in on of my first posts that this is one of the facets of medical mj I agreed with. As far as avoiding side effects of painkillers as well, I completely understand that too.

[The Budmaster]

Yes, depending on the person those drugs may be more effective. However, you forgot a huge part of the equation... Health. Those drugs damage your body. Not to mention they are all EXTREMELY addictive... Give you very bad withdrawals and makes you dependent on them. Cannabis does not.

In the interest of being healthy, most people I know would rather use marijuana and have the effect be less strong than take painkillers.

But then you get into stuff like IBS and Crohns and there are no prescription drugs that can even come close to cannabis as far as it's effectiveness.

-The Budmaster

[blackened85]

Originally Posted by DaleGribble

An opiate at appropriate level doesnt make you feel nearly as fucked up as weed though, not to mention it comes in prescrible doses that can be regulated. And side by side, i am certain those painkillers would act to block pain receptors far more effectively than marijuana in doses from smoking.

And I didnt find pain relief because I had swelling that was worsened by weed dilating my blood vessels.

And why did we switch to only speaking about painkilling capabilities? I already admitted in on of my first posts that this is one of the facets of medical mj I agreed with. As far as avoiding side effects of painkillers as well, I completely understand that too.

Why are you hung up on smoking marijuana, just because it's the most convenient vehicle for delivery of THC, it certainly doesn't make it healthy simply because you are inhaling combusted plant matter, of course there's going to be side effects associated with that. What about vaping, edibles, extracts etc? You're only focusing on the negative aspects of a single method of intake.

[J.R.R. Tokin]

Because the pharmacies fear that all the money they have dropped on useless drugs will go to waste.

[UnbyJP]

Originally Posted by Medicine Al

This is another backhanded slam on the efficacy of natural medicine in general.

Dale, this is so basic, it should only be interesting to small children.

Use the word Cannabis, there is no 'Weed' here in this forum.

You sound like a jealous alcoholic junkie.




This is one seriously unobservant individual.

Analgesic is medicine. Anti-Carcinogenic is medicine. Anti Inflammatory is medicine. And Cannabis is all of these and more.

You are just a pool of wasted youth, DaleGribble.

Don't come into the Medical forum with your beer goggles on.

^^ I'm gonna have to agree with this guy here. You're not addressing the responses and just repeating the same shit. It alleviates symptoms without having to take another "more efficient, useful drug" that the AMA or US govt forgot to tell you is way more addictive than cannabis and surely has a much higher toxicity. It is against big pharm to legalize because as mentioned previously, people would still want the raw (dried plant) form, and even if all users were to buy from a pharm, they wouldn't make nearly as much money from selling medical grade cannabis as they would selling a pill-form drug of THC (marinol), and even selling a script of THC pills would result in a loss of business compared to selling people multiple prescription drugs for all their varying ailments.

You seem to be operating on the misconception that big pharm is all about the well being and health of the public, when in fact big pharm is ONLY about money, money, and more money. If there was a wonder drug that could cure everything, wtf incentive would big pharm have to sell it if they lose all their customers after everyone is cured? They much rather prescribe a pill for you back pain that causes nausea, then a pill for your nausea that causes insomnia, then a pill for you insomnia that causes migraines... you following me here?

Last point I'd like to make is that anyone seriously using cannabis as medicine would vape, tincture, or consumables.

[carvershores]

Nobody is trying to bash cannabis or say that it's not useful, were just saying that the empirical data to prove a lot of the claims that some people are making just isn't there yet. The point hes getting at is that none of these studies have concluded that cannabis is some kind of "wonder drug" as many try to play it out to be. Sure there is some evidence that points to some interesting possibilities, but to outright say that cannabis cures cancer is just ignorant since it's based almost totally on speculation. He's also trying to say that covering up the pain(like pain medication does) is NOT the same as curing the problem itself... Furthermore it would be foolish to think that different people with different health problems would all react the same way(remember that cancer is a very broad term).

[DaleGribble]

Originally Posted by blackened85

Why are you hung up on smoking marijuana, just because it's the most convenient vehicle for delivery of THC, it certainly doesn't make it healthy simply because you are inhaling combusted plant matter, of course there's going to be side effects associated with that. What about vaping, edibles, extracts etc? You're only focusing on the negative aspects of a single method of intake.

Actually, I didnt focus on ANY negative aspects of marijuana... I used the word smoking, and I thought as I was writing that word, to mean consuming. I didnt think it would be necessary to write smoking/vapiing/eating because I figured the nitpicking in this situation wasn't relevant to what I was saying.

and again, perfecto carvershores.

[The Budmaster]

Originally Posted by carvershores

but to outright say that cannabis cures cancer is just ignorant since it's based almost totally on speculation.

I've seen exactly zero people ever make that claim. Kind of pointless to argue against something noone is saying. The only talk I've seen of Cannabis curing cancer is when they've done studies showing that it may help... but that's not total speculation is it?

I still am a little dumbfounded by everyone completely ignoring 75% of my argument. I, nor most other people I know, don't want to put prescription drugs in their body unless it's an absolute last resort. If I have something that alleviates my pain and improves my quality of life, and is also healthier than competition from the pharma companies, I should have the choice to use that instead of being forced to buy and ingest dangerous and highly addictive chemicals from big pharma.

You guys seem to be saying that because there is already a solution out there, no matter how well it works or how dangerous it is, that is enough. You - who have absolutely no medical background and haven't read a fraction of a percent of the studies out there or even spoken to people who use cannabis for medical purposes - seem to be saying that cannabis doesn't actually provide any relief for people that use it for the wide variety of conditions that it supposedly treats, and that the people are just too high to feel anything (which, even if it were the case, most people would rather be really high than feel pain, which is where a lot of people end up anyways with pharmaceutical drugs... except the side effects or high are a lot more powerful and most of the time not pleasant like marijuana)... or are they lying about it?

Again, all of this based on nothing but your own conjecture which isn't informed by actual medicine or science in the slightest. Of course, not having any of that knowledge and having read maybe 1 or 2 studies, if any, put you in the position to say that you don't think the empirical evidence is there yet. I guess if it's too much to read, just ignore it and say that none of it is convincing. Or, as the OP did, read one study and then make broad judgments on that.

And... if you really need a study to show you that Cannabis has very valid medical uses, start here with this guy:

YouTube - Cannabis & Multiple Sclerosis

Then, you can start reading through this forum or many others, or a variety of other sites that have testimonials from people who are able to use it medically for a wide variety of conditions both legally and illegally. Marijuana has given hundreds of thousands of people their life back.

Not to mention, the flaws you mentioned like it not being regulated or having prescribed doses... that is a DIRECT consequence of it being in the legal grey area due to prohibition.

-The Budmaster

[carvershores]

Originally Posted by The Budmaster

I've seen exactly zero people ever make that claim. Kind of pointless to argue against something noone is saying.

Are you serious??
http://forum.grasscity.com/medical-m...son-story.html
hemp oil cancer - Google Search

Originally Posted by The Budmaster

I still am a little dumbfounded by everyone completely ignoring 75% of my argument. I, nor most other people I know, don't want to put prescription drugs in their body unless it's an absolute last resort. If I have something that alleviates my pain and improves my quality of life, and is also healthier than competition from the pharma companies, I should have the choice to use that instead of being forced to buy and ingest dangerous and highly addictive chemicals from big pharma.

I don't believe I ever once tried to tell you what you should or shouldn't put in your body. I simply stated that cannabis can help alleviate the claim which is NOT the same as healing/curing something. Whether the alleviation is coming from cannabis or opiates is irrelevent?

Originally Posted by The Budmaster

You guys seem to be saying that because there is already a solution out there, no matter how well it works or how dangerous it is, that is enough. You - who have absolutely no medical background and haven't read a fraction of a percent of the studies out there or even spoken to people who use cannabis for medical purposes - seem to be saying that cannabis doesn't actually provide any relief for people that use it for the wide variety of conditions that it supposedly treats, and that the people are just too high to feel anything (which, even if it were the case, most people would rather be really high than feel pain, which is where a lot of people end up anyways with pharmaceutical drugs... except the side effects or high are a lot more powerful and most of the time not pleasant like marijuana)... or are they lying about it?

You seem to have a problem with reading comprehension because I never stated any of this either. I simply stated that covering up the pain and curing something are NOT the same thing... Therefore the idea that cannabis is some "miracle drug" that cures most/all medical conditions(isn't that the name of the thread?) is debunked.

Originally Posted by The Budmaster

And... if you really need a study to show you that Cannabis has very valid medical uses, start here with this guy: YouTube - Cannabis & Multiple Sclerosis

Again, I don't believe that anyone here has stated that cannabis has no valid medical uses. We simply stated that alleviating pain and curing are NOT the same thing(starting to see a pattern here?)...