Soil or Hydro PC Grow Box

[mike827]

After seeing these $800 PC Grow Cabs. I set out to make a better one, for cheaper.

My first, and most important part is the computer. Its an old server I had lying around.
It measures 24" tall (yeah its tall ), 15.5" wide, and 7" deep.

I haven't decided how many plants, what lights or grow technique I will be using.

A small 50w HPS for example, will output 4000 lumens. However, im assuming that i will have to keep much more distance between the light and the plant than if i was using fluorescents. (I know this is true if i have a 600w HPS vs. 4' fluoro tubes, but does the same hold true with such a small HPS?)

Right now i'm leaning towards fluorescent mainly for space issues. I want to cram every possible inch of vertical space, so if i need to back the plants off from the light, thats bad.
Still deciding between a bunch of 12" tubes for canopy lighting (due to its slim height, or a big CFL even though it takes up more vertical space.)

Im pretty sure im gonna do hydro, with a shallow low lying 15x7x4" res. (or should i make it taller than four inches? I guess it depends on how many plants.)

Probably gonna do one plant at a time, mainly because i don't need plants fighting for root space in such a small hydro or soil grow as this one. Planning on doing some kind of LST or SCROG to maximize yeild. Current plan is to place a low lying screen about 4" above the plant and train the plant to grow its main stem perpendicular to the floor, and parallel to the screen. Then allow colas to grow upwards the remaining 14". (if res is 4" tall, and plants are 4" tall and fluoros take 2") probably gonna have to take some steps to increase vertical space.

Pictures:

PC: CFL's: Tubes:
computer.JPG comp2.JPG

Not sure what would be best still.

Here is a CFL lumen chart from energy star:



Or should i use tubes?

a 10watt 12" t5 tube puts out 400 lumens. If i can fit 6-8 side by side as the canopy, thats a min of 2400 and a max of 3200 canopy lumens. Plus i can always put tubes vertically. (im still looking for a t5 high output of similar size (12-14")

the key is t5 tubes are only 5/8" in diam, verses the big spiral CFL's.

what do you guys think?

[mike827]

Ok, I've pretty much decided to go fluorescent due to the heat output of HID bulbs being too great for such a small space.

The real question left is CFL's vs. Tubes.

Which leads me to another question.

On average, how many lumens of fluorescent light does one plant require?

I've been searching the forums, and have gotten many different numbers. Right now I'm leaning towards 5,000 lumen's per plant.

Any ideas?

[mike827]

Ok, I've decided I'm gonna use a DWC hydro system in my box.

Now, i just finished gutting the case, and i bought a reservoir. It is(9.5"l x 6.5"w x 2.75"d which is 169.8 cubic inches or about 3 quarts (.7 gallons)

Do you think this is enough for one plant's root space? I will be ScrOG'ing the plant, and the maximum height is 18"

I have decided on using CFL's. But I am torn about lumen's. I think i would need at least 5,000 lumen's for one plant inside 1.5 cubic feet so say 47 lumen's per square inch.

So really, how many lumen's is sufficient for one plant?

I plan on using a minimum of 5600 lumen's, and a maximum of 6900 lumen's.
(i have two choices. One 105w CFL that puts out 6900 lumen's, but is 4.5 inches in diameter (lowering my available vertical space to 16.75" or Two 55w CFL's that put out 2800 lumen's each, but with a 2.8" diameter, giving me 18.45" of vertical space.)

Also, do "full spectrum" CFL's work for flowering? It says "full spectrum high definition 6500k bulb" and the other says "full spectrum high definition 5000k bulb"

I'm going to assume that the lights would be the 6500k or 5000k spectrum, and not be suitable for flowering.

[psionblue]

Hi Mike!

6500k can work for flowering but red is better. Have you thought about LED light bulbs? I know of a guy making 660nm edison bulbs. Stay away from chinese stuff.

I thought 50w+ a square foot is enough for a grow? You could do 2 23-28W CFLS that way you can mix and match.

Wouldn't soil give you the most room? Have you looked at autopot? You could hook a smartvalve up to your res and grow in dirt.

Don't forget that CFLs put out more light on thier sides.

Good luck!

[mike827]

Thanks for the info, so i guess 6900 lumen's was overkill lol.

I was only thinking hydro because i thought i could buy a smaller reservoir and get the same result than using a pot. (basically i am concerned about vertical space. The reservoir i have now is 2.75" tall, and I figured a soil based grow would need a pot larger than that to hold an equivalent amount of roots.)

what do you think? is it really worth it to do soil? I have some experience with hydro and thought that it would be faster and allow for a smaller pot/reservoir.

Let me know what you think!

[mike827]

Well heres an update.

I has an Indoor/Outdoor Grow goin, but 3 of my 4 plants died. (bad seeds). So I have one plant, in soil, in this PC Grow Box, under one CFL light. I will wait until this plant is about 4-5 leafsets tall, then transplant outdoors, at which point i will start a DWC ScrOG inside this PC case.

Here's some pics.


This is how the computer looks next to my other one under my desk.


Inside the box


My plant!

Let me know what you think/tips!

[mike827]

Heres some more updates. Per the suggestion of 420-420 I upped the lights, in the meantime i'm waiting for a 6900 lumen CFL coming from www.1000bulbs.com



Plants fan leaves grew slightly last night, but for some reason this morning they were like twisted. Will take another pic in about an hour and i'm sure they'll be straight.



The thing is that the stem looks really weird and I tried to get a picture of it for u (the color of the stem is weird.)

[mike827]

Do plant roots grow sideways? For example if i put the plant in one of those like windowsill planters that are more horizontal than vertical, will the roots expand outwards (like grass sends shoots laterally), or will it follow the rules of geotropism and grow with gravity? (stems and leaves do the opposite due to geotropism, they grow against gravity.)

By the way, i've been having troubles with this plant, as posted in the http://forum.grasscity.com/general-i...-so-small.html thread.

As everyone suggested, I picked up some Miracle Grow Organic Choice soil, but im torn between transplanting into a horizontal planter, transplanting into a larger pot, or keeping it in the cup until it gets bigger.

[mike827]

Well guys, I got some really good news.

My light fell on my plant sometime last night, and has been that way for about 6 hours without me knowing.

My plant is now dead, all the leaves are burned and shriveled.

YAY!

So i guess im gonna germinate some more seeds tonight and see what happens.

[fdebozo]

mike837,

not to sound harsh but that plant wasnt looking like it was going to "grow anywhere" in that soil... is that even soil? it looks really compacted and doesnt' look like it has good drainage anyway. it doesn't look like a good growing medium. you want to make a soil mix that has good water retention but also needs to be able to drain excess water effectively.

technically this is hydro, but try getting a good ratio of peat moss, vermiculite, and perlite (a soil-less mix) and fertilize the water you will feed to the plant. also, in this way you can be sure what you are giving your plants at all times through checking the llevels of ppm/ph in the water as opposed to trying to check the actual grow medium. also this is great because you can flush the medium and start from scratch any time you like, making correcting things like overfeeding VERY easy and simple... basically, flushing will let you start w/ a clean slate on the feeding side of things!

anyway, good luck on the PC box build!

[mike827]

thanks for the tips, The day it died I was about to transplant into some miracle grow organic, but yeah, thats life for ya.

[brokencage]

Originally Posted by fdebozo

mike837,

not to sound harsh but that plant wasnt looking like it was going to "grow anywhere" in that soil... is that even soil? it looks really compacted and doesnt' look like it has good drainage anyway. it doesn't look like a good growing medium. you want to make a soil mix that has good water retention but also needs to be able to drain excess water effectively.

technically this is hydro, but try getting a good ratio of peat moss, vermiculite, and perlite (a soil-less mix) and fertilize the water you will feed to the plant. also, in this way you can be sure what you are giving your plants at all times through checking the llevels of ppm/ph in the water as opposed to trying to check the actual grow medium. also this is great because you can flush the medium and start from scratch any time you like, making correcting things like overfeeding VERY easy and simple... basically, flushing will let you start w/ a clean slate on the feeding side of things!

anyway, good luck on the PC box build!

Good advise.A simple vermiculite and perlite mix is also very very easy to maintain.I don't know why people tell beginners to start with soil.it is not easier.

[Scapris]

Originally Posted by mike827

Heres some more updates. Per the suggestion of 420-420 I upped the lights, in the meantime i'm waiting for a 6900 lumen CFL coming from www.1000bulbs.com



Plants fan leaves grew slightly last night, but for some reason this morning they were like twisted. Will take another pic in about an hour and i'm sure they'll be straight.



The thing is that the stem looks really weird and I tried to get a picture of it for u (the color of the stem is weird.)

Correct me if I'm wrong.. But does this even look like a marijuana seedling? I've never seen leaves that looked like that on a seedling in my life :\

-Mark

[mike827]

yes it is a marijuana seedling. unless somehow some other plant grew out of a marijuana seed that was identical to 4 other marijuana seeds that sprouted successful marijuana

[eyec0n]

dude that soil looks like crap. Theres no perlite in it... it looks SOAKED and hella compact. I have a hard time believing your gonna do anything with that stuff.

Get some better soil, STAY AWAY FROM MIRACLE DEAD - If you take a few minutes to look at the back its in plain writing that it still has nutes. At leased the bag of MG Organic Potting Mix I looked at did. Just avoid it.