Hey, I'm brand new here and this is my first post. What I'm not brand new to is taking cuttings. Been taking them for 20 years now, and have always found them the trickiest part of growing. Every other phase of growth has always been so predictable, in that if I take the correct actions I will see the right results as a consequence, or consistent repeatability. With cuttings however, methods that worked great many times in a row, 95%+ survival, would then randomly or repeatedly fail despite seeming to do nothing different. Any method that proves viable with 90%+ survival should be repeatable, and if it's not I suspect bacteria is the problem, which is the topic of this post. I've been through various mediums and methods, probably more with Oasis wedges than any other medium, they were my favorite and standard for a long time. With Oasis wedges in an ebb and flow unit and a humidity and temp controlled by stats I came the closest to an automated reliable system. Yet after moving this setup to a different location it became less reliable ?? So of course I had to try the EZ-Clone when it came out and have been playing with two EZ-Clone units for some time now with varying results which I want to share, and get feedback about. I found there were two separate challenges with my EZ-Clones: first, getting the cuttings to root, and second, having them survive and flourish within the EZ-Clone after they root, long enough to develop enough roots to transplant well, this being the harder part. Any well rooted cutting that survived the EZ-Clone always did fine in it's next medium. I had zero success getting them to root with my tap water which is from a drilled well and quite hard and 500ppm plus. A reverse osmosis system changed that. With RO water under 10ppm I immediately started having cuttings root. My best rooting results were with just plain clean RO water, nothing added. I'd just dip cuttings in either Rootech gel or liquid Hormex. I think the Hormex actually did the best, being liquid perhaps it soaked into the cutting better before the sprayers could wash it off ? Who knows, but simple and clean has been best. But the EZ-Clone was still far from reliable. Bacteria troubles would botch many an EZ-Clone batch even after I got them to root and sometimes even before they could, despite thoroughly bleaching everything between cycles. The EZ-Clone seems to be a perfect nursery for bacteria. I keep a pretty clean ship, and even ran air filters in the room to keep it cleaner, but slime always seemed to find it's way in. Even 100% rooted batches with clusters of inch long roots would suddenly yellow and die after some slime formed, and roots turned from white to brownish. Keeping the water at 70 degrees instead of 80 may have helped a bit but also slowed rooting giving bacteria more time to get in. So the EZ-Clones were hit and miss, not reliable enough to really count on when there's no time to waste. In case you don't know EZ-Clone just came out with a product called Clear-Rez to fight hydroponic bacteria troubles. The active ingredient is chlorine, who'd a thunk it ? While fish can't tolerate chlorine it seems plants can handle levels high enough to prevent bacteria. To clarify, this solution is used DURING rooting, not for cleaning between cycles. Clear-Rez sells for $20 a pint, so I bought some and tested it with my pool test kit, and it seems that ONE gram of calcium hypochlorite pool shock dissolved in one gallon of water yields the same level of chlorine as the Clear-Rez. Either solution is then added to the EZ-Clone at one ounce per five gallons water, or one ounce in an EZ-Clone 30, 2oz in a 60, 4oz in a 120, and repeat every few days. The final chlorine level in the EZ-Clone is very low, about 1/25th the level in a home swimming pool. And since pool shock is $5 a pound, it costs 1$ to make 100 gallons of this solution, or one cent per gallon ! As opposed to $160 per gallon for the Clear-Rez ! I'm not saying both are exactly the same, but I do know the chlorine content is the same, according to any pool test(Sorry EZ-Clone but the units were expensive enough to begin with). Alternately 12ml of 6% sodium hypochlorite(household bleach) per gallon yields the same strength solution, though I haven't tried this in the EZ-Clone yet. I like the sound of calcium over sodium but either should work. Onto the ultimate point though, several EZ-Clone batches have now been 100% slime free, and white roots have not gone brown. They not only root well but flourish in the EZ-Clone longer than I've ever been able to leave them in there before, I can let roots grow all the way to the bottom. Also there is no need to keep the water cool. And I haven't even gone through my fist penny's worth of homemade anti-biotic. Also I have doubled the dose to 2oz per 5gal with no problem. I am curious at what concentration plants will be harmed by the chlorine instead of helped, so I'll keep experimenting. So anyway, I wanted to share this with those who could use it. I know some may find chlorine as intolerably non-organic, but it is very dilute and sure has been handy so far, and I bet it would do just as well in other methods and mediums. Oh, also, never add peroxide to chlorinated water as it instantly removes the chlorine, unless you want that of course. Cheers !
great post, one of the hardest things for beginners to grasp is how cloning works and what helps ensure success. I for one do not like how cloning plugs/root gel behave, so have switched over to a bubble cloner--this information is very relevant and I'll keep it in mind!
Is a bubble cloner where the cuttings are actually imersed in water with an airstone below ? Or are they above the water like an ezclone ? How sucessful has this method been ? I'm always up for a new experiment. I bet a little hypochlorite could be handy in this method also.
Go to the DIY section and check out rumpleforeskins clone machine thread, i built the cloner use distilled water and 2 drops of superthrive, 100% success rate everytime, no ph up or down, straight distilled and superthrive, use and aquarium heater in it to keep the water temps at 80 degrees and youre golden, no need for humidity dome or misting the cuttings, 14 days tops, i try to make my cuttings at least 4-6 inches, once you get a handle on this method you wont have cloning problems again, and BTW no rooting gel/powder/ or any other rooting hormones needed, ive done runs with and without rooting gel and the rooting gel batch took and extra 10-14 days, plus that stuff get into your pumps and could be the source of your bacteria problems, a phrase to live byin growing "KISS"- Keep It Simple Stupid (no disrespect bro) hope it helps and keep growin btw - budslinger has a good cloning setup too, thats actually where i got the recipe for the water to use
Very informative post. I thought my EZ clone experience was going well until all of my plants started yellowing and dying one by one. I was also using hard well water. I'm going to apply these tips to my next clones. Thanks!
You can just add some Hydrogen peroxide to the water once or twice a week to kill any bacterial growth.
I very much believe in H2O2/peroxide as a means of adding extra oxygen to the nutrient solution, but as a bacteria control I've had poor results with it in various situations, and especially in my ez-clone, even at fairly high doses. I tried regular doses of 30% h2o2 in my ez-clone and it didn't seem to even delay the slime. Some bacteria like extra oxygen and even flourish around h2o2. The chlorine has been much more effective though. At least for me.
what the op said we heard a while back and called bs, tried a cap full of bleach on the 120 site ez cloner and never looked back. its wild how well they work after that.
I have also tried dunking GH Rapid Rooter plugs as well as Oasis wedges in this chlorine solution, with better cutting survival and health in both as a result. It sounds funny to say it, but pool shock has been the best hydroponic tool I have discovered in a while. Chlorine is very quick to break down as well, as anyone with a pool knows, so I don't believe there is any risk of it remaining in the plants thru harvest. Guess I'll keep experimenting...
Hey I have had 100% rooting on all my cutting using http://clonebucket.com/clonebuckets.htm Also using clonex, I know could have built it myself but u get some extra goodies with the buckets some rooting nuts ect ect but the shit works great no complaints here with using it. I own the clone8 one.
yeaa need to find a way to clone successful as well ! ... i grow in soil ! and from experience cloniing in soil takes a very long time !! i had bought a cloner kit in past but it was hydro and boy did the roots come out quick !!!!!!!! my question is what step i should be taking make the clone root in hydo cloning kit then transfer to soil ! ..
Great info but I am concerned about the amount listed to use. you stated 1 gram per gallon then later one ounce per 5 gallons. An ounce is 28 grams so it shoudl treat 28 gallons correct ?
Oh wait I see now. Mix one gram to make the solution then add one ounce of the solution to the tank. Makes sense now. Sorry for the dumb question. This rocks ! I hated dealing with regular house bleach and H202 is a PITA and expensive as well.
very informative i have never used any of those type of cloners as i have no problem ever with rooting i always use hormex powder i have been curios though to trying an air layer on a pot plant i can do it on trees but not sure i could on a pot plant i think i may try it on one of my plants
I have been an avid H202 user but might try this in all my reservoirs now. I did the math and these guys are using about $30 worth of the same active ingredient to repackage and sell for $800,000, yes 800K ........ I use 1 gal of H202 per week too so it adds up.
Thank you for this thread. Fantastic. We need to clear something up though. We are taking something in powdered form and then dosing a reservoir with something liquid. The way I read the previous posts is the following: Take 1 gram (weighed on a scale) of powdered pool shock and add it to 1 gallon of water. Mix this up and this is the concentrated shock-juice. Now I take this shock-juice and put it in my Ezclone reservior at 1oz per gallon? Please confirm.
Yes I mix it stronger and add 1 teaspoon per 5 gallons. I use it in large res too so it makes it a lot easier.