Get a harvest every 2 weeks

[calicartel]

Originally Posted by Al B. Fuct

Depends... if they are past 4 weeks flowering, they ought to have some decent early bud development. It's very psychologically hard for any grower to snip off the lower branching once they have become productive, but the buddage you'll get off those lower branches will generally be less dense and more leafy than upper buds. Those lowers will also restrict air circ around the plant, potentially encouraging powdery mildew or bud mould. It's up to you, but I'd lop them.

A bit of troubleshooting:

I definitely clipped those plants, everything on that batch looks great!

However, my first batch, while I was gone for the weekend, crept up closer than my usual 12" distance to the light. Now the very tops are not budding very well, and they look like they're not going to "fill" in. I moved the lights higher up, but I was checking to make sure that it probably wasn't any variable other than heat. The temp was, upon entry, 85 degrees where the tops of the plants were. Should I investigate another cause, or is it safe to assume it was just to hot so close under the lamp?

thanks!

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by calicartel

Should I investigate another cause, or is it safe to assume it was just to hot so close under the lamp?

Nope, I think you have found the problem.

Radiant heat is 'splitting' my tops right now too. I haven't got my cooltubes in yet, should get after it!

[calicartel]

Originally Posted by Al B. Fuct

Nope, I think you have found the problem.

Radiant heat is 'splitting' my tops right now too. I haven't got my cooltubes in yet, should get after it!

No kidding... I saw some on Craigslist the other day for only $100/tube. Short on funds till harvest though.. How long do you think until the plants recover? They're still looking good, but I need those tops to fill in, and harvest is only 2-3 weeks away. Any experience on how many days it takes? Today i checked the temp and it was 75.8 at the tops, yet they still looked as they did yesterday. Thanks a bunch, Fuct; I feel like this forum's been holding my hands through this first one.

By the way, on a side note, you were right about the coco baskets. Roots are beginning to come out the bottom, but the plants are pretty content in them... am I going to have problems because of this?

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by calicartel

No kidding... I saw some on Craigslist the other day for only $100/tube. Short on funds till harvest though.. How long do you think until the plants recover?

I don't think they will. Once growth has divided, it has divided. I've never seen a plant with a split or 'runny' top cola begin to form more lumpy colas on top. Sorry to be the bearer.

By the way, on a side note, you were right about the coco baskets. Roots are beginning to come out the bottom, but the plants are pretty content in them... am I going to have problems because of this?

The biggest problem is if roots begin to knit with the roots of nearby plants or if they continue to grow significantly outside your pots. If you move the plant, the roots may be torn off, giving you something like transplant shock (wilting, slow development, etc). Roots inside a plastic pot are a lot harder to physically damage. Plastic pots have a few drain holes that roots may poke out of, but the pot will stop much root formation outside the pot.

[calicartel]

Originally Posted by Al B. Fuct

I don't think they will. Once growth has divided, it has divided. I've never seen a plant with a split or 'runny' top cola begin to form more lumpy colas on top. Sorry to be the bearer.

Al,

I'm about to cry on that news. Moving forward, what should I do? Do I snip the tops or just let the bottoms keep filling in? Any suggestions? In the past 5 years, this has never happened to me (no more weekend trips during the grow season)

Thanks-

Cali

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by calicartel

Al,

I'm about to cry on that news.

sorry, mate.

Moving forward, what should I do? Do I snip the tops or just let the bottoms keep filling in?

That's what I'd do. You won't let it happen twice, I'm sure.

[VeoDigital]

How do you cool that 1000w hps bulb?
How many clones are under the 1000w bulb, in all 4 trays at one time?
I usualy go by the rule of thumb 10,000 lumens per/plant, should the same be followed when only growing the one cola? or is the per/plant target lower because of the method of only growing the single main cola?
Do you use any supplement lighting? UVB/A bulbs (reptisun), or other cfls?
Ive only used soil as my medium, should the ph be 5.3-5.8 even in rockwool and soil after transplanting to 8" pots? or is that just because you use shreaded rockwool floc?
Whats your medium of choice after the roots pop through rockwool cubes?
I also saw what I thought to be your odor control, like an ionizer air freshener also seen in public restrooms at venues. What is that thing? lol..I been using the ONA/soil moist homemade odor control in a bucket with a fan dispersing it into the air. it works moderatly good.

Love the info, thanks again much appreciated.

EDIT: After looking more thoroughly I noticed you said you used one 1000w per tray. So basically 20-24 per bulb I assume? At 145,000 lumens per 1000w hps (i used hortilux as the standard) thats roughly 6000 lumens per plant..?

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by VeoDigital

How do you cool that 1000w hps bulb?

The two 1000s are presently in batwing fixtures, cooled by convection. I have bought a pair of cooltubes but haven't installed them yet. As usual, I should have done it a few weeks ago...

How many clones are under the 1000w bulb, in all 4 trays at one time?
I usualy go by the rule of thumb 10,000 lumens per/plant, should the same be followed when only growing the one cola? or is the per/plant target lower because of the method of only growing the single main cola?

EDIT: After looking more thoroughly I noticed you said you used one 1000w per tray. So basically 20-24 per bulb I assume? At 145,000 lumens per 1000w hps (i used hortilux as the standard) thats roughly 6000 lumens per plant..?

The 10K lumens per plant rule of thumb is a new one on me. Lots of variables in that, including, as you note, plant size. You'll find a figure of 50W of HPS lighting per sf is rather commonly accepted.

Do you use any supplement lighting? UVB/A bulbs (reptisun), or other cfls?

No- adding fluoros to 1000W HPS lighting is like hanging a model airplane engine off your WRX. Waste of time.

HPS lighting produces plenty of UV, all the way down to UVC at 253nm. No need to add more. By percentage in the spectrum, it's equivalent to the UV content of sunlight in most places (except Antarctica, which gets a lot more UV than you want!)

Ive only used soil as my medium, should the ph be 5.3-5.8 even in rockwool and soil after transplanting to 8" pots? or is that just because you use shreaded rockwool floc?

Rockwool is somewhat alkaline and requires the pH of the nute solution be run a bit low to compensate.

Whats your medium of choice after the roots pop through rockwool cubes?

I used to pack the pots full of rockwool floc from bottom to top but I've always thought that floc holds too much water for too long. I've recently started putting just about 1-2" of floc in the bottom of the pots and filling the remainder with Fytocell "flakes" (more like 'crumbs'). My theory has been proven a bit as now the Fytocell gets filled with rootmass, while the floc in the bottom of the pots only has roots around the outside of the floc, where it is most exposed to air. The layer of floc in the pot bottoms is necessary, both to keep the fytocell crumbs from escaping the drain holes and to keep the pots from floating. Fytocell has a very high air content and is buoyant.

I also saw what I thought to be your odor control, like an ionizer air freshener also seen in public restrooms at venues. What is that thing?

It's a UV ozone (O3) generator aka an ioniser. O3 kills scents as well as fungi and bacteria. You can generate O3 with high voltage (corona) or with UV light. HV type ozonators also produce nitrogen oxides, which when mixed with humidity or wet surfaces forms nitric acid. Not nice on plants. If you must use a HV corona type O3 gen, put it in the exhaust air stream only. UV ozonators can be used in plant areas with no trouble. If you notice small yellow spotting on leaves near your UV ozone gen, put it on a timer to run it perhaps only every other 15 min.

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by VeoDigital

EDIT: After looking more thoroughly I noticed you said you used one 1000w per tray. So basically 20-24 per bulb I assume? At 145,000 lumens per 1000w hps (i used hortilux as the standard) thats roughly 6000 lumens per plant..?

Look more thoroughly yet.

There's four trays. There's two 1000s. Each pair of trays is served by one 1000. That's about 46-48 plants per 1000.

The trays are 820mm x 820mm or 2.7'^2 or about 7.2 sq ft each. Each 1000 is lighting 14.4 sq ft, yielding 69.4W/sq ft. I'm fairly well pounding them, considering 50W/sf grows usually do very well.

[VeoDigital]

Damn dood, quite a detailed response, I appreciate it. Youve made things so clear for me, I feel reborn lol. Too bad my op has to be on such a smaller scale. Im going to give this a shot, but maybe just in soil. Cant find fytocell anywhere, and If I went ebb and flow, hydro, etc my wife would kill me. Mainly I keep my op discrete and number of plants low because of her.

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by VeoDigital

Damn dood, quite a detailed response, I appreciate it. Youve made things so clear for me, I feel reborn lol.

Thank ya Jebus, thank ya lord.

Too bad my op has to be on such a smaller scale. Im going to give this a shot, but maybe just in soil.

Rotsaruck. If you've been reading this thread comprehensively, you know why soil doesn't work terribly well in this application.

Cant find fytocell anywhere,

Might not have made it overseas from Australia yet. See http://www.fytogreen.com.au We're always slightly ahead of the rest of the world.

and If I went ebb and flow, hydro, etc my wife would kill me. Mainly I keep my op discrete and number of plants low because of her.

Solution is simple. Kick her silly arse out.

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by chimera
You can't have to much light! period!!! If you can control the heat add more.

Sorta true. There's a point of diminshing returns, where more light doesn't make much difference. Depending on the pruning style, this point is somewhere between 50-60W/sf.

"The goal is 10,000 lumens per plant" - Marijuana Growers Guide

Just for a moment... imagine that Ed Rosenthal and Jorge Cervantes could make a mistake, mkay?

'Lumens per plant' presumes a particular growing technique and plant size. 'Lumens per square foot' eliminates the variable of the way one grows the plant from the suggested amount of light power.

[Al B. Fuct]

One more thing... be careful how you employ the lumens figure. It is a measure of the intensity of light, the amount of 'push' behind your photons, not the number of photons hitting a particular measured point.

Lumens are analogous to volts in an electrical circuit. Voltage is a measure of the energy potential or force pushing an electron, as opposed to current, measured in amperes, which actually is a measure of the number of electrons passing a single point in an electrical circuit (in coulombs per second if you want to be precise).

Lumens thusly don't "add"!

If you put a pair of 145,000 lumen lamps next to one another, intending to light a certain common area, the luminous intensity, as measured in lumens, is still 145,000. Neither light became brighter (or more intense) because they were placed next to one another.

This is why 100 x 1500 lumen CFLs won't grow plants anywhere near like a single 150,000 lumen (1000W HPS usually put out ~145K lumens) HPS lamp. CFLs are low intensity light sources and pairing or ganging them doesn't make them any more intense or brighter.

[SaRaNaC]

Al frist i wanna say nice setup but i have a question. what is the white stuff you put on the rockwool, i am guessing it fights algae

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by SaRaNaC

Al frist i wanna say nice setup

Thanks.

i have a question. what is the white stuff you put on the rockwool, i am guessing it fights algae

It's Fytocell, a polymer resin plant growing medium.

Algae will grow on any medium that you can grow a plant in, but watering by flooding the media from the bottom keeps the tops rather dry, too dry to support algae most of the time.