Get a harvest every 2 weeks

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by nueb

This is whyI luv this thread, thanks for the info, since its my own home modifying is not an issue. I do have tile, so that makes it a bit easier.

Coolio.

I was figuring in the $3000 mark somewhere anyways, have about $2700 now to get started. I figured I would build first and get everything ready to go even if it takes a month or two ( finace reasons) Im a patient person ...

Having everything built, ready and running before you sprout a bean is the very best way to go. Nothing need be hurried up to catch up with the plants when they unexpectedly are ready. You can simulate plants in the op by hanging a bath towel under the lights, with a corner of the towel dipping in a bucket of water. You can then run the op and see if it keeps temp & RH correct before you ever put a plant in it.

nice grow btw the new set up must be workign well. you can see the difference in the plants very healthy!

Yep, it's working much better.

I have only done hydro in a very small set up 9 a plant or two) and mainly have used soil, so this should be interesting.

Flood hydro is as easy as soil and performs much better. Used media is much lighter in weight and easier to dispose of than old potting soil. Automated watering, once dialed in, is superior to hand watered soil grows.

Also wto do you keep ur humidity at, I was keepign mine about 42% I wanted high resin buds, you think this is too much? or too less? thanks for all the help

RH won't generally affect the resin content of your buds; that's the DNA's department. If you have crap DNA, perfect conditions won't make it into fines herbes. I run my flowering area at 30-50% to suppress bud mould.

Originally Posted by nueb

any chance you have a pic of your curtain wall?

I would shoot one but it would just look like a polar bear in a snowstorm.

It simply is a sheet of panda film looped over a 2x4 so that the black sides face each other, white sides out to reflect light back to the plants in the areas the curtain is separating. The 2x4 is screwed to the ceiling joists. This creates a double layer of panda film which is lightproof for our purposes, preventing the 24H veg lighting from interfering with the flowering area's dark hours.

[calicartel]

Originally Posted by Al B. Fuct

I certainly explored different sorts of media as I was never happy with the level of root oxygenation going on in floc. A pot of floc does remain too wet for too long- at least until the plant gets really rather large and can suck up around a litre or so a day. Smaller plants in floc can act like they are being overwatered.

I'll be interested to see what happens with the fibre pots; I hope they don't go to bits on you in wk4... would make quite a mess.

Fytocell seems to be a decent compromise, holding enough water to get a plant through a day when a pump has failed but not keeping the roots saturated in stagnating water. As you note though, Fytocell can be watered more than 1x day, conducting more O2 to the roots.

Plugging up the bottom of each plastic pot with a couple inches of floc is certainly doing the job here for stopping buoyancy as well as keeping the Fytocell crumbs in the pots. The plants I've harvested recently still have most of their rootmasses attracted to the bottom of the pots, regardless of whether they have 50mm of floc packed in the bottoms or are fully filled with Fytocell and the drain holes covered with a knee-hi stocking.

I hope so as well, regarding the pots not breaking on me in week4. I'd probably cry; but then I'd get over it and switch to something more tried-and-true.

I have another question: on my oldest set, I forgot to trim the bottom nodes. Now they're in week 5. Should I still trim the bottom nodes off to get one main cola, or now that the plant's heavily budding, should I just let it go?

Too late?
Thanks!

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by calicartel

I have another question: on my oldest set, I forgot to trim the bottom nodes. Now they're in week 5. Should I still trim the bottom nodes off to get one main cola, or now that the plant's heavily budding, should I just let it go?

Depends... if they are past 4 weeks flowering, they ought to have some decent early bud development. It's very psychologically hard for any grower to snip off the lower branching once they have become productive, but the buddage you'll get off those lower branches will generally be less dense and more leafy than upper buds. Those lowers will also restrict air circ around the plant, potentially encouraging powdery mildew or bud mould. It's up to you, but I'd lop them.

[TalkN2Bob]

Are there any good guides to building and running a hydro setup like yours

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by TalkN2Bob

Are there any good guides to building and running a hydro setup like yours

Yeah, man- you're reading it.

[nueb]

Ok so you double up on the panda film then inorder to face white to both sides... ok sounds simple enough. what CFM are you running in each area? my reflectors have a 6" vent holes. Do you think its more benefical to have the conversion lights? I have 1 1000hps and 1 400hps, I know MH can trmedously help out the mums and my 400 is conversion so I figured I would just use that for it but is it necessary to have a conversion mh/hps for the flowering area? You said you dont veggie the clones so I suspect it wouldnt matter much. what I am most stuck on is my venting I had some problems before with it and am really unsure on what cfm to run and the best way to set it up. advice/ideas are much appreciated.

~Cali Gurl~

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by nueb

Ok so you double up on the panda film then inorder to face white to both sides... ok sounds simple enough.

Nothing to it.

what CFM are you running in each area?

The mums and their 400HPS are in a sub-closet sized space, about W 1.5' x L 6' x H 7'. Doesn't take much exhaust blower for that small space. It has a 150mm Allvent axial (of unknown CFM) and employs passive intake (no intake fan).

The flowering area is exhausted with a 250mm Spectrum Customline centrif blower, model C250L. The C250L has a 195W motor and is next to silent, moves 410L/sec (~870CFM). There's a pair of 200mm axials on the flowering area intake, which together move somewhat less than the capacity of the exhaust blower. This keeps the room at a slightly negative pressure; all the air that leaves the area goes through the exhaust blower. If the intake fans can move more air than the exhaust, the room will have a positive pressure relative to atmosphere and scents will leak out via any small air gaps in the room.

Do you think its more benefical to have the conversion lights? I have 1 1000hps and 1 400hps, I know MH can trmedously help out the mums and my 400 is conversion so I figured I would just use that for it but is it necessary to have a conversion mh/hps for the flowering area? You said you dont veggie the clones so I suspect it wouldnt matter much.

I used a 400MH conversion over my mums for a while and didn't like it much. I had used a 400HPS to veg the mums for some years, thought I'd try the MH conversion. Mums recovered significantly more slowly under the MH after doing a pass of cuttings off them than under the 400HPS, so I went back to the HPS and put the MH lamp on the shelf!

what I am most stuck on is my venting I had some problems before with it and am really unsure on what cfm to run and the best way to set it up. advice/ideas are much appreciated.

Your exhaust blower must be able to change the entire volume of the room air in about 3-5 minutes. If the room is 500 cu ft, it needs a minimum 100CFM blower. It is better to have too much fan capacity than too little- you can always use a fan motor speed controller to slow them down. If you have a long duct run or a carbon filter on the exhaust, you should use a centrifugal blower. Axial blowers won't work well pushing into a high static pressure caused by obstruction. Of course, exhaust blowers should be thermostatically controlled. The exhaust should be located on the ceiling or high on a wall to take advantage of warm air rising. Intakes correspondingly should be located near floor level. Passive intakes should be 2x the diameter of the exhaust blower. Powered intakes should push no more than 80-90% of the exhaust rating to keep the room at negative pressure.

[Quite Colorful]

dude this is the type of grow ive been trying to plan for quite some time. im moving back to the u.s soon will definitely have journal of a very similar grow, most likely on a larger scale. thank you for such accurate details. can finally put this train in motion!

[nueb]

well thank you very much, that was much help. So your saying that in your case the MH conversion is not necessarily more benifical. So I could simply operate on my regular hps, which is a good money saver since I already have them. Thanks for the specifics on the Venting, big help! I am sure I will have many more questions . so basically if I have an exhaust that is more powerful then my intake that is ok correct? did you go to a hardware store (like the depot) to get your fans or did you order them online, if you did do you happen to have the link to the company so I can browse around. thanks and much appreciated.
~Cali Gurl~

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by nueb

well thank you very much, that was much help.

No wucking furries.

So your saying that in your case the MH conversion is not necessarily more benifical. So I could simply operate on my regular hps, which is a good money saver since I already have them.

Vegging with HPS works fine for SoG ops. HPS does cause mums to be more elongated than with MH, but that's in fact desirable in this case as it gives you nice long stemmed mums from which to take big clones, which suits this no-veg-time technique. See my thread on cloning for SoG, linked in my signature.

Thanks for the specifics on the Venting, big help! I am sure I will have many more questions

Ventilation is the biggest hurdle in any good grow op. Closets and other finished spaces generally are hard to ventilate adequately.

Don't forget about oscillating circ fans- in every corner of the room. Every leaf in the op should flutter at least once a minute.

so basically if I have an exhaust that is more powerful then my intake that is ok correct?

Yep, intakes can be cheap axial fans- they're not working very hard if you have a good centrifugal blower on the exhaust. Intakes should be moving about 80-90% of the exhaust blower's rate.

did you go to a hardware store (like the depot) to get your fans or did you order them online, if you did do you happen to have the link to the company so I can browse around. thanks and much appreciated.

Nup, just went to ye olde local hydro shop.

Hardware stores may have inline axial 'duct' fans which will suit some grow-op purposes, but if you're looking for serious centrifugal blowers, you're most likely going to need a hydro shop, either online or bricks-and-mortar.

[Quite Colorful]

Hey Fuct- quick question man...

I'm working with 14 bonsai moms, as for now just been selling clones because they're impossible to find around here. All together the ladies give out about 200-280 a month. Because I am starting this sog grow soon, will no longer be doling out clones, and will most likely only keep 7 or 8.

Because they're small the cuttings anywhere from 3-6''. Would you recommend growing them out, then removing the lower branches, or ditching the bonsai and letting them grow out first, then take clones.
Thanks a lot dude you've helped out immensely so far.

-Colorful

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by Quite Colorful

Would you recommend growing them out, then removing the lower branches, or ditching the bonsai and letting them grow out first, then take clones.

When I put a clone in to be raised as a mum, I snip off the main growing tip to force growth to divide. In about a week, I might again snip off growing tips on the new shoots to force further division. After about 10-14 more days, the plant will be ready to donate cuttings, delivering 6-8 thick stems for clones. Each time I do a batch of clones, I trim back the mums quite severely- see my thread about cloning for SoG.

[bigjohn]

Originally Posted by Al B. Fuct

If all the flowering trays (23 ea max), the mother tray (10 max) and the clonebox (30 max) are totally full, there's 132 plants. Yep, that could surely be a legal problem, more serious in some localities than others.

Vegging and immature flowering plants don't make much smell. It's the buggers in tray #4, in wks 6-8 which really get whiffy. I have a UV ioniser running in the space and am presently cooking up a seriously ballsy ioniser with 5x 20W UV tubes for the exhaust duct. I'm trying to avoid a carbon filter as I would prefer not to have the flow restriction of a filter in the ventilation system. Works pretty well right now without a filter but for a few days near the end of wk8 in tray 4, I'll admit there's a scent problem I could work on. That's on today's to-do, BTW. Waiting on some UV tubes and ballasts from an electrical supplier.

However, one way to keep scents down a little is to not dick around with flowering plants much. Disturbing the plants by touching the buds, knocking the plants against one another, etc. will break a few resin trichomes open and release their perfume.

I noticed that buy not moving them as much does keeps oder down. Btw very nice write up some day when i get off my ass i'll compile all my pics and info to share with everyone. good job dude

[lush1]

I'm thinking about doing a similar grow that is exactly half the size of this one, using a 1kw cool tube in a 6'x4' walk in cupboard. I know its a tight area but it has an 8' ceiling and I was planning on kepping fans, filters etc above the lights along the ceiling. Was originally thinking 2x 600w but I reckon the temps would be too high.

It think that maybe I have the floorspace but am worried that temps will get out of control, although I will have no problem venting out through a chimney. Bear in mind I live in Blighty where the average summer temperature is about 15 degrees although we do get heatwaves in the sumer.

This thread is an inspiration, thank you Al for cutting through all the bullshit that you get on these sites.

[Al B. Fuct]

Originally Posted by lush1

I'm thinking about doing a similar grow that is exactly half the size of this one, using a 1kw cool tube in a 6'x4' walk in cupboard. I know its a tight area but it has an 8' ceiling and I was planning on kepping fans, filters etc above the lights along the ceiling. Was originally thinking 2x 600w but I reckon the temps would be too high.

Cooltubes will sort that, no matter whether you choose a pair of 600s or a single 1000. The room airmass temp & RH will remain more stable if the cooltube supply air is sourced from outside the room airmass. The cooltube exhaust must be dumped someplace where it can't be sucked back into the room's airmass.

It think that maybe I have the floorspace but am worried that temps will get out of control, although I will have no problem venting out through a chimney. Bear in mind I live in Blighty where the average summer temperature is about 15 degrees although we do get heatwaves in the sumer.

Should be OK with properly set-up cooltubes. Having a disused chimney for exhaust is great. However, don't be tempted to share a chimney which is in use by gas appliances, etc. You can inadvertently force carbon monoxide into the house with predictably fatal results.

This thread is an inspiration, thank you Al for cutting through all the bullshit that you get on these sites.

Thanks.